Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: December 29, 2024, 4:25 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
Hello, Anyone interested in a debate?
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate?
Nestor huh? Would that be the Nestor of Homeric fame?

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote: There is an "atheistic position" (speaking for myself) and it involves disbelief in your piety towards imaginary beings. It doesn't negate metaphysical possibilities. It merely views them with a mind open to admitting its fallibility.

As to your implied definitions, I find your notions of chemical reactions, meat automatons, and impersonality borderline impious ;-)

I am not say my imaginary friend is better Big Grin I am simply saying that for us to make moral decisions we will each appeal to that which lack sufficient direct explicit empirical evidence to meet the general Atheistic requirement for existing.

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote: Imaginary friends are by definition of "imaginary" not external... though you are absolutely capable of pretending they are.

I confess "imaginary" to be a misnomer. I do not contend ones person or God is imaginary in fact. But my threshold of proof is not direct explicit empirical evidence. As stipulate many times in this thread I am satisfied with the same level of proof which follows the scientific method (that is circumstantial implicit empirical evidence). When one speaks to the congregation (or the critic) they would be wise to tailor their more controversial statements in a manner they already accept Big Grin

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote:
(May 21, 2015 at 4:50 pm)Anima Wrote: In the case of an atheist that imaginary person is the self and is commonly referred to in terms of the sentiment of the self or the conscience.
It's a remarkably puzzling phenomenon, isn't it?

Puzzling? No. Many theists do the same thing. Take the logic to the point you like and stop. Theists often do this when they attempt to argue intelligent design (which is predicated on the same logic as the homunculus argument leading to infinite regression). Atheist, so far, appear to do it in regards to "proof" (accepting as proven their own person and scientific fact, while subjecting what they do not wish to accept to a level of proof that even their own person and scientific facts could not satisfy.) No shocker there... Faints

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote:
(May 21, 2015 at 4:50 pm)Anima Wrote: Otherwise the method of ethical conduct to be adopted is utilitarian and will lead to immoral situations.  For example skinning 10 kids alive because it makes 100 people happier than it make the 10 kids miserable.  While supported by utility we would argue this response is not correct.  
Agreed. That's a very unsophisticated utilitarianism you've conjured up.

I did not want to lose the forest for the trees. Big Grin

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote:
(May 21, 2015 at 4:50 pm)Anima Wrote: Our argument to the incorrectness of this response will be predicated on something other than utility.  For the theist it will be the imaginary guy in the sky.  For the atheist it will be that they do not "feel" it is right.  Which leads me to my initial meat automaton statement how there is no "person" to feel.  Thus the feeling is imaginary or fictitious.
I would rather imagine myself as one of those 10 kids.

You may imagine yourself as one of those kids. However, that would take you down the untenable path of subjective morality which is self contradicting as the other 9 kids and 100 people would opt to skin you according to their subjective morality.

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote:
(May 21, 2015 at 5:36 pm)Anima Wrote: I understand.  Which is why, by mean of philosophy, I have stated that adopting the position of disbelief without empirical evidence negates the existence of one's own "person".
So you've rejected the somewhat arbitrarily defined boundaries that your brain has recognized as advantageous distinctions between your biological composition and your environment... thus...

I am not sure if this statement was supposed to support any argument in your favor or not. I take it to mean that you are stating the brain has inherent bias in it that it considers advantageous, and that we should stick with those biases Huh. This would be new to the argument, but short lived, as it leads to the argument that anything I have an impression of, whether imaginary or real, is a defined boundary my brain recognizes as advantageous and should be left alone. It sounds like an argument to remain ignorant. Did you intend it to mean something different?

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote:
(May 21, 2015 at 5:36 pm)Anima Wrote: Should any of us then hold that we will not engage in action based on utility, but rather upon the belief of our "person" we are forced two accept two things.   

1) We recognize the existence of metaphysical things without empirical evidence; in which case atheism is unfounded. 
No.

Oh!!! I love this game... Yes. Big Grin

(May 29, 2015 at 12:41 am)Nestor Wrote:
(May 21, 2015 at 5:36 pm)Anima Wrote: 2) We accept that our moral conduct overrides our ethical conduct by means of an appeal to a metaphysical thing where:
A) Atheists hold the metaphysical thing as their person
B) Theists hold the metaphysical thing as something beyond their person.
]Hence, our morality (Atheist and Theist) requires an appeal to a metaphysical (fictitious/imaginary) thing.
No. Atheism allows you to discover or refine the metaphysical thing, theism requires you to accept something that doesn't make much sense but can be presented on simplistic but certainly mythological terms that are made to appear possible while accomplishing nothing and distracting from the issue.

It would seem that atheism does not allow you to discover anything due to requiring a level of "proof" that no knowledge seems to satisfy (for further details on that continue enjoying this thread of posts). I would state that you are oversimplifying theism, but then you oversimplified atheism in the beginning of your comments so...Hooray for consistency Big Grin
Reply



Messages In This Thread
Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 3:50 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:03 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 3:57 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 12:28 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 1:42 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 22, 2015 at 11:28 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:16 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:12 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Cato - May 21, 2015 at 4:05 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:26 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:41 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 10:13 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 3:50 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 30, 2015 at 2:03 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 2, 2015 at 1:36 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 3, 2015 at 3:40 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 4, 2015 at 7:16 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 10, 2015 at 12:13 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 10, 2015 at 6:02 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 12, 2015 at 11:51 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 12, 2015 at 12:04 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 12, 2015 at 1:01 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 12, 2015 at 7:10 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 14, 2015 at 8:20 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 15, 2015 at 3:31 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 15, 2015 at 4:23 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 12:26 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 1:40 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Ace - June 16, 2015 at 9:34 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:50 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:23 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:55 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:02 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 10:53 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:52 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 4:59 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Exian - May 21, 2015 at 4:55 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:09 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:16 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:26 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:36 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Cato - May 22, 2015 at 10:10 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 3:51 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 5:13 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Cato - May 22, 2015 at 6:19 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 22, 2015 at 10:30 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Cato - May 24, 2015 at 8:00 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Jenny A - May 22, 2015 at 7:24 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 5:45 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 9:13 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 23, 2015 at 11:44 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 24, 2015 at 1:54 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 25, 2015 at 7:42 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 26, 2015 at 12:40 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Cato - May 24, 2015 at 7:48 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 5:40 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Alex K - May 21, 2015 at 5:43 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 21, 2015 at 6:01 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 10:32 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 22, 2015 at 10:43 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 11:05 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 22, 2015 at 11:15 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 11:27 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 10:40 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Jenny A - May 22, 2015 at 10:48 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Longhorn - May 22, 2015 at 10:46 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Jenny A - May 22, 2015 at 10:39 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by LastPoet - May 22, 2015 at 11:35 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 1:52 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 5:35 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 2:02 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 3:26 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 22, 2015 at 10:08 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 22, 2015 at 11:47 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 23, 2015 at 11:11 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 24, 2015 at 12:49 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by robvalue - May 24, 2015 at 10:11 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 24, 2015 at 12:54 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 24, 2015 at 2:45 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 24, 2015 at 9:39 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 24, 2015 at 3:20 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 12:50 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 24, 2015 at 10:51 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 26, 2015 at 8:20 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 9:52 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 27, 2015 at 10:53 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 11:05 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 27, 2015 at 12:05 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 1:46 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 3:49 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 11:28 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Jenny A - May 28, 2015 at 11:40 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 27, 2015 at 4:49 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Chas - May 28, 2015 at 11:23 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 28, 2015 at 11:38 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Chas - May 28, 2015 at 12:53 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 28, 2015 at 1:38 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Chas - May 28, 2015 at 6:17 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 28, 2015 at 7:55 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Chas - June 1, 2015 at 9:39 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 1, 2015 at 11:47 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - June 1, 2015 at 12:22 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Chas - June 1, 2015 at 12:32 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 1, 2015 at 1:47 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 28, 2015 at 4:03 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 1:36 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Esquilax - May 28, 2015 at 10:47 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 1:10 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 1:25 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by comet - May 28, 2015 at 10:43 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - May 28, 2015 at 10:38 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 28, 2015 at 11:44 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 1:45 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 5:04 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 5:15 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 7:40 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 29, 2015 at 10:20 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 30, 2015 at 6:19 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 30, 2015 at 7:57 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Jenny A - May 30, 2015 at 11:17 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 30, 2015 at 8:48 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 31, 2015 at 12:31 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - May 31, 2015 at 1:24 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 1, 2015 at 10:22 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Silver - June 1, 2015 at 10:30 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 1, 2015 at 11:16 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Angrboda - May 31, 2015 at 10:51 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 1, 2015 at 9:35 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Cyberman - June 1, 2015 at 12:51 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 1, 2015 at 11:20 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Chas - June 1, 2015 at 11:27 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Silver - June 1, 2015 at 11:19 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 2, 2015 at 11:34 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 2, 2015 at 6:51 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Ace - June 2, 2015 at 7:20 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 6, 2015 at 1:13 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 12, 2015 at 1:59 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by LastPoet - June 15, 2015 at 12:49 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by pocaracas - June 15, 2015 at 12:53 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 15, 2015 at 3:48 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 5:20 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 5:30 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 5:47 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 6:30 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 6:46 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 7:31 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 7:49 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 8:07 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 8:21 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 8:26 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 16, 2015 at 9:32 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 16, 2015 at 11:16 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 27, 2015 at 12:00 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 27, 2015 at 6:32 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 28, 2015 at 1:28 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 28, 2015 at 8:16 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 29, 2015 at 2:04 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 29, 2015 at 6:39 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 30, 2015 at 3:54 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 30, 2015 at 7:35 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - July 2, 2015 at 2:01 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - July 8, 2015 at 4:43 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Ace - June 17, 2015 at 11:08 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 29, 2015 at 12:59 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 30, 2015 at 10:25 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by brewer - June 29, 2015 at 5:55 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 29, 2015 at 6:44 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by brewer - June 29, 2015 at 9:38 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 30, 2015 at 9:34 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by bennyboy - June 30, 2015 at 10:31 am
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - June 30, 2015 at 6:33 pm
RE: Hello, Anyone interested in a debate? - by Anima - July 2, 2015 at 2:01 pm

Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Free Will Debate Alan V 82 7778 November 27, 2021 at 7:08 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Debate Invitation John 6IX Breezy 3 805 September 1, 2019 at 2:05 pm
Last Post: John 6IX Breezy
Thumbs Up VOTE HERE: Final four questions for the Christian Debate vulcanlogician 43 5775 May 18, 2018 at 10:23 am
Last Post: Edwardo Piet
  1st Call for Christian Only Debate: Our Role on AF Neo-Scholastic 132 20384 May 4, 2018 at 12:11 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  The Definitive Post On The Free Will v. Determinism Debate BrianSoddingBoru4 17 3917 September 3, 2016 at 11:20 pm
Last Post: Arkilogue
  Debate Challenge TruthisGod 127 22125 November 20, 2015 at 2:13 am
Last Post: Neo-Scholastic
  Moral realism vs moral anti-realism debate is a moot point Pizza 1 1161 March 7, 2015 at 8:13 pm
Last Post: CapnAwesome
  Discussion on debate between Esquilax and His_Majesty. Esquilax 169 34705 November 16, 2014 at 2:43 am
Last Post: Minimalist
  Can you help me debate better? Doggey75 20 4393 April 2, 2014 at 8:37 pm
Last Post: psychoslice
  Philosophical help with a Christian debate paulhe 25 8457 September 22, 2013 at 9:08 pm
Last Post: Faith No More



Users browsing this thread: 19 Guest(s)