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Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter?
#9
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter?
(July 19, 2015 at 1:37 am)luka Wrote: If there are any Christians perusing the forum I would like to ask you a question. I've been an atheist for about 4 years now and only one question still troubles me about Jesus. Why does it matter if he was tortured and crucified? If he was a godly being, with dominion over nature and the entire universe, surely he would have the ability to not feel pain. How would pain even be scaled to a supreme being? 

True. However, Jesus was also fully human, and he experienced hunger, cold, and pain just as we do.

Now, in terms of sacrifice for our sins, it was not REALLY necessary that Jesus be tortured and suffer. However, if he had simply walked into Pilate's office and said, "I'm here for my beheading" followed by a quick sword stroke, I don't think that WE would think quite as much of that as we do of the scourging, the crowning with thorns and the crucifixion. The latter execution is FAR more graphic and helps us to appreciate the lengths to which God was willing to go in order to redeem us. It was a heavy price, but He paid it.

Quote:Furthermore, I don't understand why an eternal, omniscient being would decide that he would need to put himself through a few days of pain in order to save his creation from their sin. Even if he did suffer horrendous pain, it still would prove nothing. It wouldn't prove he was honorable, trustworthy, or that any of his teachings were correct. While sacrificing yourself for something greater than yourself is honorable, it doesn't absolve others of their sins. It also doesn't count as a sacrificial act if Jesus rose from the dead and took his seat as the ruler of the universe again. 

The crucifixion doesn't matter.

If your child breaks a large bay window in a neighbor's house that he cannot possibly pay for by himself, you step in to pay the debt to the neighbor. The neighbor is satisfied and the child is no longer under obligation.

We could not possibly repay our debt to God for the sins we commit, so Jesus stepped in to pay it for us. We are absolved, and we are no longer under obligation.

The crucifixion means everything.
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Messages In This Thread
Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by luka - July 19, 2015 at 1:37 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 19, 2015 at 1:59 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 19, 2015 at 2:40 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Athene - July 19, 2015 at 2:54 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 3:07 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:07 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 10:11 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:16 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 10:17 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:52 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 10:56 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 11:05 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 11:54 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 12:17 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 12:22 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 10:18 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:53 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 11:49 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by polar bear - July 19, 2015 at 10:18 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:54 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 19, 2015 at 10:59 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 11:07 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 11:59 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 9:51 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:09 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 10:14 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by polar bear - July 19, 2015 at 10:15 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 10:16 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:49 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 11:43 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Bob Kelso - July 21, 2015 at 1:35 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by vorlon13 - July 19, 2015 at 9:54 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:04 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 10:11 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:34 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 12:06 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 12:27 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 12:30 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 12:32 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 12:06 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 19, 2015 at 10:06 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Longhorn - July 19, 2015 at 10:16 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:36 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 19, 2015 at 10:14 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 19, 2015 at 10:22 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Whateverist - July 19, 2015 at 10:29 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 19, 2015 at 10:31 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 10:57 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Chad32 - July 19, 2015 at 10:44 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 19, 2015 at 10:45 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 11:00 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 19, 2015 at 10:54 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Chad32 - July 19, 2015 at 10:54 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 11:03 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Chad32 - July 19, 2015 at 12:04 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 11:14 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 11:53 am
Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by KUSA - July 19, 2015 at 11:41 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 12:02 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Nope - July 19, 2015 at 12:13 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 12:30 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Randy Carson - July 19, 2015 at 12:24 pm
Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by KUSA - July 19, 2015 at 2:47 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Godschild - July 20, 2015 at 10:57 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Spooky - July 20, 2015 at 10:59 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by The Valkyrie - July 20, 2015 at 11:10 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Spooky - July 20, 2015 at 10:58 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Godschild - July 20, 2015 at 10:55 pm
Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by KUSA - July 20, 2015 at 11:17 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Spooky - July 20, 2015 at 11:22 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by The Valkyrie - July 20, 2015 at 11:27 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Godschild - July 21, 2015 at 12:02 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Silver - July 21, 2015 at 12:21 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Spooky - July 21, 2015 at 12:43 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Cato - July 21, 2015 at 2:46 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Pyrrho - July 21, 2015 at 10:56 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Spooky - July 21, 2015 at 12:11 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Godschild - July 21, 2015 at 12:15 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 21, 2015 at 12:30 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 21, 2015 at 2:25 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 21, 2015 at 2:37 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by robvalue - July 21, 2015 at 11:05 am
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 21, 2015 at 12:54 pm
Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by KUSA - July 21, 2015 at 12:33 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Minimalist - July 21, 2015 at 3:50 pm
RE: Why does Jesus' "suffering" matter? - by Pyrrho - July 21, 2015 at 4:18 pm

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