(August 10, 2017 at 10:31 am)Crossless2.0 Wrote:(August 10, 2017 at 9:48 am)rjh4 is back Wrote: I have no idea what your initial point is. Could be I'm dense. Could be you are a horrible communicator. Of course I would pick the latter and assume you would pick the former.
Anyway, regarding: "It was understandable back then when humans didn't know any better, but we know better now."
As it relates to evidence, I think the more we understand, the more problems it raises for a naturalistic explanations. Think about it. When cellular live was seen as just a black box unknown, it is easy to imagine things just spontaneously happening. Think: Spontaneous Generation. But the more we learn about the complexity of the cell and all that is needed for replication, it seems harder and harder for a naturalistic explanation to make any sense whatsoever. So to me, a naturalistic viewpoint was more understandable back then when humans didn't know any better, but we know better now.
What an addled response! Spontaneous Generation was a "naturalistic" viewpoint only in the sense that it didn't explicitly invoke a god, though it might as well have since it had exactly the same explanatory scope and power: nil. The rest is nothing more than an argument from ignorance and incredulity. Yes, cell biology is extremely complex. You know how we know that? Because methodological naturalism has revealed the cell's complex (and, so far, entirely natural) mechanisms. It certainly wasn't revealed to us by imaginary friends or holy scripture.
Luckily for all of us, the men and women who study cell biology for a living don't throw up their hands in the face of difficult problems and invoke the supernatural/magic/favorite-imaginary-friend as an "explanation" for what we don't currently understand.
Thank you for having my back here. Theists stupidly think we cant see what they are doing.
The con works like this.
1. Pretend you are not arguing for your deity.
2. Attempt to debunk science.
3. If you are lucky enough to sell it to a gullible person, once you FALSELY sell the con, insert your pet flavor of deity into the gap.
4. If people are wise to the con, resort to trying to retrofit science to your comic book after the fact. Pretend science points to your particular club.
He's not getting the fact that EVERY RELIGION has followers who pull this crap. Christianity isn't the only religion to attempt this.
The argument from complexity really ultimately is nothing more than falling for your emotions, "Life has pretty things in it".
Well sure, I'll agree with that. But there are also lots of nasty things in life that are also complex. Ecoli, Eboli, Cancer, poisonous insects and and snakes, and dangerous animals like crocks and gators and hippos. Cockroaches are far better breeders than humans and outnumber humans and have been around far longer.
The earth is 4 billion years old. Since the start of evolution, there have been 5 mass extinction events as to which 99% have gone extinct and what we see now is a mere 1% left over. I find it absurd that a cosmic factory boss would take all that time, allow all that extinction and only wait to about 200,000 years ago to get to making humans, then wait until only about 10,000 years ago to finally get to humans writing or him even saying anything. That doesn't seem to me like anyone is pulling the strings.
It looks more like humans back then merely made bad guesses because they didn't have any modern science to explain what was really going on.
Knowing I can choke on food and potentially die from that, knowing we share the same eating and breathing tube doesn't seem like a good "design" knowing whales and dolphins don't have that problem.
