(June 22, 2017 at 8:50 am)Khemikal Wrote: I don;t know how many ways I can explain to you that this doesn;t matter, if what you want to show is a problem in someone -elses- argument....
It doesn't matter, until you act as if it's my actual position, and build arguments from that (false) foundation. Then it matters.
Quote:SAure, but what you -can't- do is show an -internal- problem without accepting it, for the purposes of argumentation.
Yep, but when you then act as if I accept the premise in actuality, rather than just for the purposes of this specific argument, we have a problem.
Quote:They've obviously assumed it for the purpose of argument, to show what they feel is an internal inconsistency....mostly because that's how that's done - and can;t be done any other way.
Yep, and you don't then ask them if they really believe in God. Yet, when I do the same, you do ask me if I think God is a mindless automaton. That's the problem.
Quote:Does it? Do you believe that it does? Just because gods omniscience as described precludes our free will..doesn't mean that it would preclude gods. Either because god is a special case, or because gods actions, unlike our own, cannot be known - and so any logically coherent conception of omniscience does not contain within it the knowledge that would preclude his own free will.
Now you're proposing a weak reason - saying that God can't know his own actions without specifying why. But we can work with it. Same thing I asked Succubus - in this scenario, God knows the necessary playout of this creation. He went ahead and created. Are you saying it was wrong for him to go ahead with this creation? Why?
Quote:In any case..-they- don;t have to come up with any such justification. It's not their baby. That's your belief..and you tossed it in there as a way to avoid discussing -their- proposition, so you could toss out a common "you too" defense of gods proposed inequity....... that doesn't even dispute that gods actions are wrong or absurd in that regard..just claims that someone else does it too.
Of course it disputes that God's actions are wrong with those presumptions. As Agenda said, "Therefore he holds no responsibility for any of his actions and is more like a powerful automaton than a person."