RE: Objective morality as a proper basic belief
July 16, 2017 at 9:15 pm
(This post was last modified: July 16, 2017 at 9:17 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
(July 16, 2017 at 8:39 pm)mordant Wrote:Nah, it's still a bad thing to chop his head off. Generally speaking, we'll want to get a guy like that in front of a jury. Though, if that's the only way, we're more than willing to do a bad thing to prevent even greater harm. Exclusively sub-optimal fields.(July 16, 2017 at 8:11 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote: Morality itself is not objective, you can get to objective moral conclusions depending on the foundation you are using to measure it. For example, if you use well-being as a foundation, then it is objectively immoral to chop off somebody's head.Unless, apparently, you're chopping off the head of a despot who caused massive ill-being to millions.
Everything is contextual, even with wellbeing as a basis.
Quote:I'm having a debate with a theist on another forum who insists that morality is objective. His go-to example is the apologist canard of "torturing innocent babies purely for personal pleasure", or in other words, "the most contrived example I can possibly concoct that you would be afraid to disagree with." Since "everyone agrees" that torturing innocents is objectively wrong, then at least some morality is objective.Sure, when there are few competing moral facts of a matter it's easy to make inarguable statements.
Quote:I think this is confusing clarity with objectivity. There's nothing particularly objective about the visceral reaction most people would have to torturing innocents. It's just that virtually all societies in all eras instinctively sanction such behavior because allowing it would make the society collapse rather quickly. There are a handful of things like this that virtually no one disagrees with, but that does not make it objective.It's only clear insomuch as there are few to no competing moral facts of the matter. If something were unclear it wouldn;t be any less objective. Imagine a sign in the distance, occluded by fog, and the slight glare of sunrise. There are many objective and subjective reasons for this lack of clarity, but the sign still says one thing or another - objectively. The same could be, would be, and is true of any objective moral system. There are any number of things that rob us of clarity. Thankfully, there are also tools to cut through that.
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