Philosophical zombies

[Edwardo Piet]

[You appear to be replying to me as if I'm Rob or something... which is odd. Lol.]

See, this just shows how confused you are. OF COURSE we know that we're conscious in the tradtional sense. It's the ONLY thing we know. We can't even talk about knowledge without talking about awareness/consciousness.

You don't know what you're talking about if you think consciousness in the traditional sense isn't known. It's all science even studies: phenomena.

I think I'm done with this convo if you can't even accept that you know that seeming to you is seeming to you. You may as well be another one of those guys arguing that 2+2=5 in another universe. Those morons who thinks Science is above all including the very axioms that science is fucking based on.

Would a p-zombie be able to talk meaningfully about consciousness? Wouldn't the fact that they *think* they are conscious mean, by your reasoning, that they are? And doesn't that show the impossibility of p-zombies?

You're incorrectly addressing a first person issue from the third person. That's the answer.

Yes, p-zeds can talk about consciousness all they like. They seem like normal conscious people from the outside, but on the inside they aren't conscious.

Each conscious person knows that they are conscious. And if you, as a conscious person, think you might not be conscious.... you're highly confused.

Talking about consciousness is different to thinking you're conscious. Furthermore, it's possible to have unconscious thoughts. So best to spot your equivocations.

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Are we insisting that self deception would be impossible for a p-zed..as a silent premise?

Unconscious self-deception wouldn't be impossible. But yes conscious people know they are conscious.