Can bible really be interpreted as if there is no torment but you cease to exist

[The Grand Nudger]

So, Pel, I'm going to be conscripted into the servixe of some absentee landlord just because I live a good life, avoiding "evil"?....I'm not fond of the idea of drafts and conscription.

[kılıç_mehmet]

Yes, *ahem*, this is the current JW interpretation as far as I'm concerned.
And the JW's also have a different view on how afterlife will look like for the faithful.

[The Grand Nudger]

The "current" JW interpretation has changed many times in the past few decades (due to failed apocalypse predictions).

[Doubting Thomas]

God doesn't want us in eternal torment.

BULLSHIT! Sorry, but why would the all-powerful and all-good creator of the entire universe create such a place and then cast souls into it? If he's all powerful and doesn't want people in eternal torment, then why can't he just get rid of Hell and not send anyone there?

That's why he sent his son Jesus to die in our stead. By giving into our selfish desires we choose and deserve eternal torment. But he takes our sentence and gives us eternal life. All we have to do is accept the gift.

And this is why God's plan is all fucked up. Instead of just saying, "You know what? I don't want to send anyone to Hell, so I'll just abolish and demolish the place, and never send anyone there to be tortured for eternity. Hey, I'm all-powerful, so I can do whatever I want," he came up with this convoluted idea of "OK, I'll knock up this virgin down there on earth and have my son tell people some things to do and get a bunch of people to follow him, but have the jealous church leaders have him killed so that I can remove this curse I put on humanity because the first two people I put down there disobeyed me even though I knew they would. But I'm not going to make it easy for people to find this path. I'll have people invent other religions to follow and make it so the only way people can keep me from torturing them for eternity is by reading and believing in a book that's extremely hard to figure out. Then I'll have the followers all keep bickering among each other which is the best way to worship me. But I'll never appear to everyone in person so they'll know exactly what I want of them."

It would be extremely easy for God not to send anyone to Hell if he really didn't want to.

[Undeceived]

God doesn't want us in eternal torment.

BULLSHIT! Sorry, but why would the all-powerful and all-good creator of the entire universe create such a place and then cast souls into it? If he's all powerful and doesn't want people in eternal torment, then why can't he just get rid of Hell and not send anyone there?

That's why he sent his son Jesus to die in our stead. By giving into our selfish desires we choose and deserve eternal torment. But he takes our sentence and gives us eternal life. All we have to do is accept the gift.

And this is why God's plan is all fucked up. Instead of just saying, "You know what? I don't want to send anyone to Hell, so I'll just abolish and demolish the place, and never send anyone there to be tortured for eternity. Hey, I'm all-powerful, so I can do whatever I want," he came up with this convoluted idea of "OK, I'll knock up this virgin down there on earth and have my son tell people some things to do and get a bunch of people to follow him, but have the jealous church leaders have him killed so that I can remove this curse I put on humanity because the first two people I put down there disobeyed me even though I knew they would. But I'm not going to make it easy for people to find this path. I'll have people invent other religions to follow and make it so the only way people can keep me from torturing them for eternity is by reading and believing in a book that's extremely hard to figure out. Then I'll have the followers all keep bickering among each other which is the best way to worship me. But I'll never appear to everyone in person so they'll know exactly what I want of them."

It would be extremely easy for God not to send anyone to Hell if he really didn't want to.

Hell is a spiritual place, not one God has to go out of His way to create. The torment we receive would be within our souls, not external fire. And by rejecting God, we have chosen it. He gave us free will. This life is meant to divide people who are grateful for God's creating them and those who are not. If you are not grateful, you don't want to be in heaven anyway. You'd rather be sent to hell. Why should He force you into a particular place just because we aren't sure what's best for us?

God is perfectly good but he is also perfectly just. We do horrible things everyday (lie, hate, covet) that plague our conscience and rip apart our relationships. This isn't about what God is able to do. Sure, He could send us all to heaven. But why should He be compelled to? Take this analogy: Your wife cheats on you. Instead of saying, "I'm sorry," she tells you, "I hate you and I'd do it again a million times over." She did wrong, but why should you forgive her if she doesn't want to be forgiven? God is like the husband, and we are like the wife. All we have to do is repent-- that means say we're sorry and ask for His forgiveness. God understands our pride, and knows this isn't easy to accept. He made us and the Gospel is about His quest to win us back. He sent Jesus to earth as an example for what real love is. We are the Lost Son described in Luke 15:11-32. The father gives the son his inheritance the day he becomes an adult. The son runs off and squanders every last cent. Eventually he comes back, poor and bedraggled, and begs to be taken back into the home. Is his father angry? No. Instead, he holds a celebration, overjoyed at his son's return. God is the father. He gave us the gift of salvation long ago. Many of us take years to come around, but that doesn't lessen the reward when we do. He still waits, the feast in heaven set and ready for our arrival. That is, if we accept Jesus and what He did for us. Once we do, all our sin and guilt is washed away as if it never existed.

[Epimethean]

Ah, yes, the bullshit meter just spiked as the allegory blob schlubbed into sight. Utter rubbish.

These monorail deities are all retards.

[Bgood]

Ah, yes, the bullshit meter just spiked as the allegory blob schlubbed into sight. Utter rubbish.

These monorail deities are all retards.

LOL that's hilarious! I couldn't agree more! Is this JesusChrist salesman for real???? In which seminary did Undecieved recieve his indoctrination?.......St. John of the Bullshit?

[tackattack]

I didn't catch up on more than one page, but here's my response.

Peace. You know how Jehovas witnesses and a few others(can someone who knows post who are the others) believe that the interpretation of eternal torment and the eternal fire means that you burn up and there fore you cease to exist.

I kind of believe that that's what God would do as a punishment and it makes sense. I mean He doesnt have to torment someone for eternity.

Now, my question To those who believe in hell same as Jehovah's Witnesses that is that you cease to exist, how does eternally tormented mean cessation of existence?

And to those who believe in eternal torment: Why would God do something like that?

Also, are Jehovah's witnesses honest with them selves in their interpretation? I suppose they really believe in it because they would not refuse blood transfusion that can otherwise save their lives at times if they where not sinciere!

Thoughts

Thanks

Many of the Lutheran and Calvanistic sects don't preach or believe in eternal torment. Most non-denominationals (while completely independant) find it morally repugnant and false doctrine.
Here's my interpretaion shared by many (argumentum ad populum not withstanding) OT Hell is Sheol and a place for all dead to go (not just the sinners). NT Hell is commonly envisioned as the lake of fire, that burns eternal, that is designed for Satan and his fallen angels. Souls in Sheol and all the rest will be cast into it after the second judgement if they aren't in the book of life. By default, if you can't get into heaven, then you're resigned to hell, where your soul will be destroyed per Jesus.
If you're curious then you can check out the Essenes influence on Christian belief in the immortality of the soul. Here's a decent article that tries an unbiased approach.

OK let's talk about this Christian/JW mythology for a second. Why would there ever need to be eternal hellfire for a finite number of souls which will be burned up? After the world ends and there's no more evil souls being cast into hell, why would the fire need to keep burning? No, I'm pretty sure the idea of eternal hellfire goes along with the idea of eternal punishment/damnation.

The fires of hell aren't burning because of the souls in there (as there are none yet). They burn forever because that's where Satan lives after the judgement, not because it's fuled by the suffering of tormented souls.

[Aardverk]

Hell is a spiritual place, not one God has to go out of His way to create. The torment we receive would be within our souls, not external fire. And by rejecting God, we have chosen it. He gave us free will. This life is meant to divide people who are grateful for God's creating them and those who are not. If you are not grateful, you don't want to be in heaven anyway. You'd rather be sent to hell.

Hello Undeceived.
If I understand this correctly, Hell isn't a real place with fire and brimstone - it is just somewhere in your head. Did I get that right?
Heaven on the other hand, according to you, is a real place that you actually WANT to go to. Did I get that right?

I have two questions.
1. Why do you choose to believe that hell is just a spiritual place inside your head but heaven is actually a real place?

2. Assuming you go to heaven, how do you imagine spending eternity? Bear in mind that there may be some restrictions on sex, especially with multiple partners or same sex partners or even by yourself, you may even have the pleasure of healthy lust removed from you. There is no apparent plan to procreate and bring up children, no need to work, plan, build, create, invent, experiment, learn, travel, there may be some restrictions on alcohol, gluttony, drugs, etc and even if you can get a TV signal up there, you will probably get a bit fed up with all the repeats over eternity. You can probably learn to play the harp and I do hear that you get plenty of time to worship God. Is that your plan for eternity?

I suggest you read Mark Twain's book, 'Captain Stormfield's Visit to Heaven". It raises a few problems with the concept of heaven.

[Phil]

Even Jesus killing the tree for producing fruit out-of-season, what point did it serve?

It's all just fairy tales from the old world, if you ask me.

Killing a tree by talking to it means one has some very strong bad breath.