There's no nicer way to say this but...

[kılıç_mehmet]

Sure, it isn't. But it's close. It's a genetic defect that, in todays world, keeps these individuals from joining normal society as it progressed throughout history. From my viewpoint, such gene defects should be closely examined, and purged from the human gene pool if possible.
Just like down's syndrome.

WHAT THE FUCK? You can't be serious... How is it a genetic defect? People are attracted to different things.

And it's not about them getting married. It's that they are tired of feeling left out of society because of who they find attractive. Banning gay marriage tells them that their relationships do not belong in the country. It tells them that they are wrong. Legalizing gay marriage would show that these relationships are acceptable.

I fucking am serious. Maybe in the far future, we can do this. I seriously see no real relevance of homosexuality to human society but to create unrest and confusion.
You're talking of it as though it was a matter of choice. And I was repeatedly told here that is was not a "matter of preference", but a fixed thing, something that you're born with, which means that there is a gene that is responsible for it, yes?
Maybe in the future we can detect such children who have high risks of showing homosexuality in the future life and abort them early on, just as we do this to children who might be born deaf, blind or mentally retarted. I certainly would not hesitate a single second to abort the ones I've mentioned in the last post, so why would I hesitate with the homosexuals?
Legalizing gay marriage serves no real purpose but to show that marriage can be bent and loosened as much as you want it to. It's to hamper with the fundamental workings of society.
Gays can be given a seperate existence, like a civil union, say.
But limits must be there.

[Matt231]

WHAT THE FUCK? You can't be serious... How is it a genetic defect? People are attracted to different things.

And it's not about them getting married. It's that they are tired of feeling left out of society because of who they find attractive. Banning gay marriage tells them that their relationships do not belong in the country. It tells them that they are wrong. Legalizing gay marriage would show that these relationships are acceptable.

I fucking am serious. Maybe in the far future, we can do this. I seriously see no real relevance of homosexuality to human society but to create unrest and confusion.
You're talking of it as though it was a matter of choice. And I was repeatedly told here that is was not a "matter of preference", but a fixed thing, something that you're born with, which means that there is a gene that is responsible for it, yes?
Maybe in the future we can detect such children who have high risks of showing homosexuality in the future life and abort them early on, just as we do this to children who might be born deaf, blind or mentally retarted. I certainly would not hesitate a single second to abort the ones I've mentioned in the last post, so why would I hesitate with the homosexuals?
Legalizing gay marriage serves no real purpose but to show that marriage can be bent and loosened as much as you want it to. It's to hamper with the fundamental workings of society.
Gays can be given a seperate existence, like a civil union, say.
But limits must be there.

I don't even know what to say to this. It's not a fucking disorder. It's sexual preference. Some men like blondes. Others might like girls with blue eyes. And others like men. It's what they are attracted to. There's no genetic defect.

It serves the purpose of showing that we give a fuck about them. That they ARE people. Obviously, to you, they aren't. But it's homophobes like you who keep societies from advancing.

[kılıç_mehmet]

I fucking am serious. Maybe in the far future, we can do this. I seriously see no real relevance of homosexuality to human society but to create unrest and confusion.
You're talking of it as though it was a matter of choice. And I was repeatedly told here that is was not a "matter of preference", but a fixed thing, something that you're born with, which means that there is a gene that is responsible for it, yes?
Maybe in the future we can detect such children who have high risks of showing homosexuality in the future life and abort them early on, just as we do this to children who might be born deaf, blind or mentally retarted. I certainly would not hesitate a single second to abort the ones I've mentioned in the last post, so why would I hesitate with the homosexuals?
Legalizing gay marriage serves no real purpose but to show that marriage can be bent and loosened as much as you want it to. It's to hamper with the fundamental workings of society.
Gays can be given a seperate existence, like a civil union, say.
But limits must be there.

I don't even know what to say to this. It's not a fucking disorder. It's sexual preference. Some men like blondes. Others might like girls with blue eyes. And others like men. It's what they are attracted to. There's no genetic defect.

It serves the purpose of showing that we give a fuck about them. That they ARE people. Obviously, to you, they aren't. But it's homophobes like you who keep societies from advancing.

People don't seem to make up their mind what the hell homosexuality is supposed to be.
If it's a preference, it means that you choose whether you like to be homosexual or not. Am I right or wrong?

They are people, but so are...say pedophiles. Theirs too, is a matter of preference, I guess.
Maybe letting them have their ways will aid society.
Maybe allowing incestious relationships to become normal will aid society to become more advanced?
I don't think I have anything else to say about this.

[Ace Otana]

From my point of view, we're quite ahead, actually. Not from your viewpoint though, I think that western society eventually regresses backwards. The age of losing one's virginity decreases, teen pregnancies on rise, homosexuality is becoming "normal" like in some ancient and medieval societies...You're like going backwards...You just don't understand it.
At the end, we'll be standing, while you've already crumbled to dust.

You're far from ahead, you're way behind us. Homosexuality is completely natural. It's perfectly normal, you just don't like it, and that's your problem.
I don't agree with teen pregnancies but couldn't take away someone else's freedom because I don't agree with it.
Be less tolerant and more accepting. A big ask I know.

[kılıç_mehmet]

From my point of view, we're quite ahead, actually. Not from your viewpoint though, I think that western society eventually regresses backwards. The age of losing one's virginity decreases, teen pregnancies on rise, homosexuality is becoming "normal" like in some ancient and medieval societies...You're like going backwards...You just don't understand it.
At the end, we'll be standing, while you've already crumbled to dust.

You're far from ahead, you're way behind us. Homosexuality is completely natural. It's perfectly normal, you just don't like it, and that's your problem.
I don't agree with teen pregnancies but couldn't take away someone else's freedom because I don't agree with it.
Be less tolerant and more accepting. A big ask I know.

I don't want to repeat myself over and over again. Not everything that is natural is normal, nor "good".
Freedom, freedom freedom. This is the only form of freedom you obviously come to know. Not the form of freedom we know here.

[Ace Otana]

I don't want to repeat myself over and over again. Not everything that is natural is normal, nor "good".

To you. It's your opinion, nothing more. It's perfectly natural and normal. Homosexuality has always been around. Before Christianity and Islam, it was something you'd see often in old Greek civilisations. Never was it frowned apone. Perhaps it's you who needs to change.

Freedom, freedom freedom. This is the only form of freedom you obviously come to know. Not the form of freedom we know here.

Freedom to be who you are, to be who you want. To live your life without intolerance. Shame you're against such freedom but then again you are stuck in that old system where you have to hate things that don't go exactly your way.

[Tiberius]

According to my knowledge, the child, Aisha (although it is disputed amongst scholars about her exact age during the time of marriage), was believed to be past her puberty and she was ready to be married and willing to be married. That's the most important thing. Also, Aisha's parents were happy with their daughter being married to Muhammad. And it was a common practice for women to get married at an early age during those times.

I mean, there is no indication that Muhammad raped his wife nor even hurt in any way. On the contrary, the two of them lived happily with each other, and they helped each other (as a normal couple would).

You know I love you Rayaan, but this is a terribly naive position to take. No, not all muslims are child molesters. No, Islam is not about child molestation. However, given that children/adolescents are abused and taken advantage of even in this day and age, one cannot hold that being past puberty means that the person is "ready to be married" and expect to be taken seriously. Children are incredibly innocent; they will often not understand things like love, sex, relationships, even if they are biologically at the age where they can bear children of their own.

There are simply too many factors to make any kind of conclusion in this case, so I'm not going to say Muhammad was or wasn't. I just think that to defend Muhammad outright ignores important considerations that need to be made, such as whether Aisha's parents really had their daughters best interests in mind (or were simply trying to gain favour with the prophet), whether Aisha was sufferer of Stockholm syndrome, whether she was too traumatised to do anything, etc, etc.

[kılıç_mehmet]

To you. It's your opinion, nothing more. It's perfectly natural and normal. Homosexuality has always been around. Before Christianity and Islam, it was something you'd see often in old Greek civilisations. Never was it frowned apone. Perhaps it's you who needs to change.

Never? Mayhap you need to read the writings of the philosophers who describe it as a bestial form of conduct, besides, it was not exactly between two grown men anyways, the ancient greeks were known pederasts, just like the medieval japanese.
And now you're telling me that this type of behaviour proves to me that homosexuality is normal and good.
IF it was good or normal, it would have not been avoided by nations who have previously not been in touch with the major world religions or touched by them in regional sense. For example, homosexuality was still a grave offense towards society in the history of our people before Islam.
Or the laws of Chingiss Khan, which have the same punishment for sodomy as with the bible, without being moslem, or christian himself.
Do not think that this is an exclusive "religious" concern.
Homosexuality was never meant to be normalized by society.
You're just trying to do the impossible, rainbow crusader.

Freedom to be who you are, to be who you want. To live your life without intolerance. Shame you're against such freedom but then again you are stuck in that old system where you have to hate things that don't go exactly your way.

Well, the fact that laws exist means that there is a certain intolerance toward certain things in society.
Some things just don't go my way. But they always have to go on the same path as society. They cannot defy society. Those who do, certainly reap their reward afterwards.

[Ace Otana]

Homosexuality was never meant to be normalized by society.

To you. Not every society thousands of years ago accepted it but many did. Homosexuality is normal and you can't do a thing about it. You can't get rid of homosexuality. They'll always be an uproar if you try, and I'll defend it as well.

Well, the fact that laws exist means that there is a certain intolerance toward certain things in society.
Some things just don't go my way. But they always have to go on the same path as society. They cannot defy society. Those who do, certainly reap their reward afterwards.

Laws are there to protect people and instil a sense of order. What harm does homosexuality cause? How does it affect you? Thing is, you just don't like it. Which is why you want to put a stop to it. Which is completely wrong. I'm very glad to be in this society where homosexuality is widely accepted. I despise dictatorships.

[LastPoet]

You're just trying to do the impossible, rainbow crusader.

(bold mine)


You're showing your prejudice Mehmet.