Why I'm not an Atheist and believe in what I believe.

[Mystic]

Padraic, I respect you taking an agnostic position but I can't say I agree with it as a logical stance.

As far as being agnostic to my position, it's either:

(1) There exists an absolute morality and we have a link to that morality and relationship to it, and hence can know definite moral facts as true.

(2) There doesn't exist an absolute morality and we have no relationship to it and we don't know moral facts.

But if (1), then surely there is a way for you to know, since you been bestowed that knowledge as well. So you just have to sincerely ask yourself if you have that knowledge.

The same is true of knowledge of God. It's not like I would be special to have that knowledge while you wouldn't. But this question can be hard. A Muslim might state he doesn't know if killing apostates is wrong so follows hadiths and scholars verdict on that, but at the same time, I feel he does know. He knows deep inside. Others know more then deep inside, they know it all through their soul and being, nothing hiding.

So from my position, all I can do is advice reflection, what you deep down inside know.

I am not proving it either way but you can prove to yourself one of these are true. If we have no knowledge of moral facts, it would be obvious as well, would it not? If we had no intuitive knowledge of God, that would be obvious as well, would it not?

Any ways, this thread was originally to answer people's questions about why I believe what I believe.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

And exactly who called him a liar? I was pointing out that the process he was using to rationalize his beliefs was the same as that of a pathological liar,

Really, that is not how I or several others read it,including Mystic Knight .

What you wrote:

Pathos: Feelings

Logic: a particular mode of reasoning viewed as valid or faulty




Patho-Logical Liar: "I feel this must be true, therefore it is true."

My response was to what you actually wrote,rather than what you meant,what with not being a mind reader and all.

[Mystic]

that is not a feeling.

Why isn't it a feeling?

[Taqiyya Mockingbird]

Padraic, I respect you taking an agnostic position but I can't say I agree with it as a logical stance.

You have already demonstrated that you haven't the slightest idea what "logical" is.

As far as being agnostic to my position, it's either:

(1) There exists an absolute morality and we have a link to that morality and relationship to it, and hence can know definite moral facts as true.

Bald, unsupported assertion-by-assertion. Non-sequitur.

(2) There doesn't exist an absolute morality and we have no relationship to it and we don't know moral facts.

Non-sequitur.False Dichotomy.

But if (1), then surely there is a way for you to know, since you been bestowed that knowledge as well. So you just have to sincerely ask yourself if you have that knowledge.

There are other ways to understand moral consequences than this idea of "objective morality". False Dichotomy, Black/White distorted thinking.

The same is true of knowledge of God.

And wait a damn minute -- now you are trying to sneak in this "god" idea through the back door. Begging the question, circular reasoning.

It's not like I would be special to have that knowledge while you wouldn't. But this question can be hard. A Muslim might state he doesn't know if killing apostates is wrong so follows hadiths and scholars verdict on that, but at the same time, I feel he does know. He knows deep inside. Others know more then deep inside, they know it all through their soul and being, nothing hiding.

Begging the question, circular reasoning.

So from my position, all I can do is advice reflection, what you deep down inside know.

Begging the question.

I am not proving it either way but you can prove to yourself one of these are true.

Same non-sequitur, circular reasoning, false dichotomy.

Any ways, this thread was originally to answer people's questions about why I believe what I believe.

Did someone actually ask you? Or is this really your proclaiming all this nonsense unbidden?

---

And exactly who called him a liar? I was pointing out that the process he was using to rationalize his beliefs was the same as that of a pathological liar,

Really, that is not how I or several others read it,including Mystic Knight .

Argumentum ad Populum.

What you wrote:

Pathos: Feelings

Logic: a particular mode of reasoning viewed as valid or faulty




Patho-Logical Liar: "I feel this must be true, therefore it is true."

My response was to what you actually wrote,rather than what you meant,what with not being a mind reader and all.

That's right. And what you DIDN'T see me write was "you are a pathological liar". Which, if you have seen any of my posts, is not something I would tap dance around for a second. Got it?

[Mystic]

Did someone actually ask you? Or is this really your proclaiming all this nonsense unbidden?

Bro, why are you so hostile? Yes people asked me different times when I state my belief of God "Why do you believe that?".

[Taqiyya Mockingbird]

that is not a feeling.

Why isn't it a feeling?

This is the basis of your problem -- your fundamental inability to discern between feelings on one hand, and thoughts, opinions and value judgments on the other.

[Mystic]

Why isn't it a feeling?

This is the basis of your problem -- your fundamental inability to discern between feelings on one hand, and thoughts, opinions and value judgments on the other.

Maybe we are using the words differently.

[Taqiyya Mockingbird]

Did someone actually ask you? Or is this really your proclaiming all this nonsense unbidden?

Bro, why are you so hostile? Yes people asked me different times when I state my belief of God "Why do you believe that?".

That's not hostile.

I could show you "hostile"

I am sure they have very good reason to ask you why, and if they have asked you enough times that you are starting a thread about it, they probably have been getting the same sort of nonsensical explanations like the ones you have proffered here from you. Likely they are trying to gently prod you into examining your faulty rationality and inability to discern between emotions and rational thought and opinion.

---

This is the basis of your problem -- your fundamental inability to discern between feelings on one hand, and thoughts, opinions and value judgments on the other.

Maybe we are using the words differently.

If we were, your explanations would not include such tripe as "going with your feelings" and eschewing any reasoning process or rational decision-making.

[Oldandeasilyconfused]

Which, if you have seen any of my posts, is not something I would tap dance around for a second. Got it?

No, I don't get it. what I see is you back pedaling from an ad hominem attack. You claim is not obvious to me from any of your pots I've read.However,I can't remember having read any outside of this post. I'll accept your were inarticulate rather than intentionally nasty.

[Mystic]

Taqiya - I think you are too hostile to have a meaningful conversation. Your intention doesn't seem to try to understand my position or to help me past my error as you perceive it. It seems rather it's just to put me down and twist my intentions behinds my words as to make me seem illogical.