Posts: 67455
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
161
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 8:49 am
(This post was last modified: June 12, 2012 at 8:50 am by The Grand Nudger.)
Hahahaha Lucifer made Satan? So...there are two forces in your magical universe capable of creating something where nothing existed before?. Fantastic!
So, I'm going to have to ask, armed with this knowledge, how are we to determine what god created and what Lucifer created? Thanks though, for providing me with an example of yet another thing god didn't create, the list of your gods accomplishments gets smaller every passing day doesn't it?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 8781
Threads: 26
Joined: March 15, 2010
Reputation:
29
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 3:17 pm
(June 12, 2012 at 4:53 am)Epimethean Wrote: Did god create Lucifer with those tendencies?
No He did not, Lucifer had free will, Lucifer allowed his mind to conceive He could be greater than his Creator, Lucifer acted upon those wrong notions, and he is Satan with a bunch of fallen angels he has power over. God will ultimately destroy him, it was not God's will that Lucifer fall, it was Lucifer's will that caused him to fall, if Lucifer had done God's will none of this would have happened. You want to blame God for the way things turned out, it's Lucifer that you should blame. It's funny in a way and pitiful in others, atheist call christians stupid and deluded, yet we are the ones that are intelligent enough to know who to blame. Ourselves for falling to the great deceiver, the father of lies, Lucifer.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
Posts: 67455
Threads: 140
Joined: June 28, 2011
Reputation:
161
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 3:19 pm
(This post was last modified: June 12, 2012 at 3:20 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Did god create the power that he uses to hold sway over these fallen angels, or is that a credit to Satan as well? "God will ultimately destroy him, blah blah blah" Promises, promises. How's that battle coming along anyway?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Posts: 13051
Threads: 66
Joined: February 7, 2011
Reputation:
92
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 4:03 pm
Godschild Wrote:No He did not, Lucifer had free will, Lucifer allowed his mind to conceive He could be greater than his Creator, Lucifer acted upon those wrong notions, and he is Satan with a bunch of fallen angels he has power over. God will ultimately destroy him, it was not God's will that Lucifer fall, it was Lucifer's will that caused him to fall, if Lucifer had done God's will none of this would have happened. You want to blame God for the way things turned out, it's Lucifer that you should blame. It's funny in a way and pitiful in others, atheist call christians stupid and deluded, yet we are the ones that are intelligent enough to know who to blame. Ourselves for falling to the great deceiver, the father of lies, Lucifer.
How can god not shoulder the blame in this mess when one, he knew what Lucifer would do, and two, he had the power to stop it? Why is it that Lucifer's actions fall outside of God's divine plan when nothing else does?
Lol at the claim that you're intelligent enough to blame Lucifer. That's priceless.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
Posts: 2254
Threads: 85
Joined: January 24, 2010
Reputation:
29
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 4:52 pm
(June 12, 2012 at 3:17 pm)Godschild Wrote: It's funny in a way and pitiful in others, atheist call christians stupid and deluded, yet we are the ones that are intelligent enough to know who to blame. Ourselves for falling to the great deceiver, the father of lies, Lucifer. You done preaching?
Within the context of fiction, your idiot god is just as much responsible for the devil as Eru is for Melkor.
Posts: 1497
Threads: 29
Joined: February 16, 2010
Reputation:
23
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 8:19 pm
(June 12, 2012 at 3:17 pm)Godschild Wrote: No He did not, Lucifer had free will, Lucifer allowed his mind to conceive He could be greater than his Creator, Lucifer acted upon those wrong notions, and he is Satan with a bunch of fallen angels he has power over.
And Muhammad rode a winged horse up to heaven. It's the 21st century and we still have mind numbed people insisting that mythology is true.
Quote: God will ultimately destroy him
Well, what the fuck is he waiting for? People like you have been promising this for thousands of years! I hope you realize your credibility is kind of shot.
Quote:, it was not God's will that Lucifer fall, it was Lucifer's will that caused him to fall, if Lucifer had done God's will none of this would have happened.
But wasn't this all part of "God's plan"? Because no matter how horrible something is, believers are quick to trumpet that "everything happens for a reason" and "it's part of God's plan".
Quote:You want to blame God for the way things turned out,
Isn't this god the one who has unlimited power and omniscience? Which means he KNEW what would happen and he did nothing to stop it. So, yeah, I can blame him.
Quote: it's Lucifer that you should blame.
Actually, I don't blame imaginary beings for anything. That would be like blaming Santa Claus because I didn't get what I wanted for Christmas.
Quote:It's funny in a way and pitiful in others, atheist call christians stupid and deluded,
Oh, I wouldn't necessarily say you're stupid....
Quote:yet we are the ones that are intelligent enough to know who to blame.
And who should we blame?
Quote: Ourselves for falling to the great deceiver, the father of lies, Lucifer.
Sorry, never met the guy.
Science flies us to the moon and stars. Religion flies us into buildings.
God allowed 200,000 people to die in an earthquake. So what makes you think he cares about YOUR problems?
Posts: 8781
Threads: 26
Joined: March 15, 2010
Reputation:
29
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 9:02 pm
You guys have the same old tiring junk to repeat over and over, can't one of you come up with something different. So many of you use coarse language to hide the truth you do not know much about scriptures, why do you not study them, so the debates can be sensible.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
Posts: 1497
Threads: 29
Joined: February 16, 2010
Reputation:
23
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 12, 2012 at 9:29 pm
(June 12, 2012 at 9:02 pm)Godschild Wrote: You guys have the same old tiring junk to repeat over and over
You mean unlike the same old, tired junk guys like you repeat over and over?
Quote:, can't one of you come up with something different.
Maybe when you come up with something different.
Quote: So many of you use coarse language to hide the truth you do not know much about scriptures,
Many atheists are more knowledgable of scripture than believers.
Quote: why do you not study them, so the debates can be sensible.
How can you have a sensible debate with someone who insists in the truthfulness of an ancient book that contains stories with talking animals, a virgin birth, people rising up from the dead, a man losing his strength because his hair was cut, etc, etc.....?
Science flies us to the moon and stars. Religion flies us into buildings.
God allowed 200,000 people to die in an earthquake. So what makes you think he cares about YOUR problems?
Posts: 7388
Threads: 168
Joined: February 25, 2009
Reputation:
45
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 13, 2012 at 12:26 am
Quote:Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
Umm no,with not believing in God and all.
IF I believed in him: I think it goes without saying that YHWH of the Torah is a sadistic cunt. So yes he enjoys his cruelty ,like a nasty little boy going around killing small animals.
YHWH is EXACTLY what I'd expect from an insular, paranoid, tribe of bronze age goat fuckers. He reflects the society which invented him,as do all gods.
Posts: 276
Threads: 3
Joined: August 20, 2011
Reputation:
6
RE: Do you recognize that God gains pleasure in creating evil?
June 13, 2012 at 12:47 am
Regardless of anything else said here, I find it very obvious that the fictional character of the Bible that we label "God" is a sadist.
He reminds me of a child with a magnifying glass roasting ants, taking pleasure in their pain and death. If a child were to command ants to obey his will, and they continued to do evil by making their colony in a way that differed from the child's wishes, I think you could rightfully say that the child is delusional or has a mental illness. This is the God of the Bible.
Except it goes one step further in this case, because God created the world in which he has precidence over and still condemns us lower beings. Despite his capacity to create people with free will that would simply never do evil in their lives, he created a world of flawed individuals and allows evil thus. It's not technically free will if he creates people that he knew with his infinite foresight would simply never choose evil?
If God creates the world with omniscience, he is ultimately responcible for every single thing that occurs in his creation. That includes needless evil, death, famine, genetic flaws, needless slaughters, and natural evils like hurricane, tsunamis, and the predator/prey lifestyle of all living things.
My conclusion is that there is no reason to believe any of the dogmas of traditional theology and, further, that there is no reason to wish that they were true.
Man, in so far as he is not subject to natural forces, is free to work out his own destiny. The responsibility is his, and so is the opportunity.
-Bertrand Russell
|
