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Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 7:57 am
I'm sure you've all heard that only "Jesus'" sacrifice is suitable for atonement for the "sins of the world".
Well, I'm calling bullshit! on that doctrine of men.
For those who wish to state that the bible is infallible, I leave you to ponder this verse.
Isaiah 6:6-7
New International Version (NIV)
6 Then one of the seraphim flew to me with a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with tongs from the altar. 7 With it he touched my mouth and said, “See, this has touched your lips; your guilt is taken away and your sin atoned for. ”
Obviously, God doesn't need a "blood sacrifice" for atonement.
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 8:12 am
catfish Wrote:Well, I'm calling bullshit! on that doctrine of men.
I'm calling bullshit on the whole damn book.
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 11:06 am
"See, you're quoting the New International Version, instead of the strict King James Version."
You'd be surprised how often I get that. Or maybe you wouldn't be, theists are just that moronic.
Gary Johnson 2012. America's representative for Reason and Logic.
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 11:21 am
(August 9, 2012 at 11:06 am)MountOlympus Wrote: "See, you're quoting the New International Version, instead of the strict King James Version."
You'd be surprised how often I get that. Or maybe you wouldn't be, theists are just that moronic.
Haha, try instead to quote the bible in Swedish or Finnish (though the Finnish one was actually very poorly translated until they revised it). It's weird that 'god's true word' has become synonymous with KJV 
When I was young, there was a god with infinite power protecting me. Is there anyone else who felt that way? And was sure about it? but the first time I fell in love, I was thrown down - or maybe I broke free - and I bade farewell to God and became human. Now I don't have God's protection, and I walk on the ground without wings, but I don't regret this hardship. I want to live as a person. -Arina Tanemura
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 12:01 pm
(August 9, 2012 at 7:57 am)catfish Wrote: I'm sure you've all heard that only "Jesus'" sacrifice is suitable for atonement for the "sins of the world".
Well, I'm calling bullshit! on that doctrine of men.
For those who wish to state that the bible is infallible, I leave you to ponder this verse.
Isaiah 6:6-7
New International Version (NIV)
6 Then one of the seraphim flew to me with a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with tongs from the altar. 7 With it he touched my mouth and said, “See, this has touched your lips; your guilt is taken away and your sin atoned for. ”
Obviously, God doesn't need a "blood sacrifice" for atonement.
Context is key..
where did the seraphim get the live coal?
What are alters for?
In the process of sacerfice when would their be a 'live coal?'
The answers to these three questions shut down/over rule your objection.
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 1:00 pm
erm... You are quoting a symbolic vision that Isaiah was having.... Isaiah was approaching God with unclean lips in a sense so he had to be cleansed from my understanding. This vision was just that a vision not some new redemption scheme.
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 1:06 pm
Cherry picking is in Voltair....you didn't get the memo?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Atonement...
August 9, 2012 at 2:07 pm
Quote: It's weird that 'god's true word' has become synonymous with KJV Tongue
Especially since it was based on piss-poor Greek translations.
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RE: Atonement...
August 10, 2012 at 5:16 am
(August 9, 2012 at 7:57 am)catfish Wrote: I'm sure you've all heard that only "Jesus'" sacrifice is suitable for atonement for the "sins of the world".
Well, I'm calling bullshit! on that doctrine of men.
For those who wish to state that the bible is infallible, I leave you to ponder this verse.
Isaiah 6:6-7
New International Version (NIV)
6 Then one of the seraphim flew to me with a live coal in his hand, which he had taken with tongs from the altar. 7 With it he touched my mouth and said, “See, this has touched your lips; your guilt is taken away and your sin atoned for. ”
Obviously, God doesn't need a "blood sacrifice" for atonement.
You can't be serious, one verse and you claim Christ is not our atonement, you really need some help, and I would recommend someone but I do not know anyone who can help jerks...
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: Atonement...
August 10, 2012 at 7:21 am
(August 10, 2012 at 5:16 am)Godschild Wrote: You can't be serious, one verse and you claim Christ is not our atonement, you really need some help, and I would recommend someone but I do not know anyone who can help jerks...
Mark 12:28-34
New International Version (NIV)
28 One of the teachers of the law came and heard them debating. Noticing that Jesus had given them a good answer, he asked him, “Of all the commandments, which is the most important?”
29 “The most important one,” answered Jesus, “is this: ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no commandment greater than these.”
32 “Well said, teacher,” the man replied. “You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him. 33 To love him with all your heart, with all your understanding and with all your strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself is more important than all burnt offerings and sacrifices.”
34 When Jesus saw that he had answered wisely, he said to him, “You are not far from the kingdom of God.” And from then on no one dared ask him any more questions.
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