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RE: Christian Nation
October 28, 2012 at 8:54 am
(October 28, 2012 at 8:40 am)Stimbo Wrote: Since AD is the initialism for "Anno Domini" and means "In the year of our lord", somehow I think that your position on this would be exactly the same if they had used it. Please feel free to tell me I'm wrong.
well said. i recant my statements presenting this line as evidence for a Christian nation. my other evidence still stands however.
Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!
-4th verse of the american national anthem
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RE: Christian Nation
October 28, 2012 at 12:00 pm
Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!
-4th verse of the american national anthem
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RE: Christian Nation
October 28, 2012 at 4:13 pm
And this speech has what to do with Christianity? Yes, he did attack atheism, and did talk about God a great deal in the speech, but, especially given that you yourself admit that Paine was a deist, you can't just say that "you can argue the meaning of the word but not the intent of the writer," like you did when talking about "In God We Trust."
And for the record, here's Theodore Roosevelt's take on putting "In God We Trust" on money:
“When the question of the new coinage came up we looked into the law and found there was no warrant therein for putting ‘In God We Trust’ on the coins. As the custom, although without legal warrant, had grown up, however, I might have felt at liberty to keep the inscription had I approved of its being on the coinage. But as I did not approve of it I did not direct that it should again be put on . . . . ”
“My own feeling in the matter is due to my very firm conviction that to put such a motto on coins, or to use it in any kindred manner, not only does no good, but does positive harm, and is in effect irreverence, which comes dangerously close to sacrilege. A beautiful and solemn sentence such as the one in question should be treated and uttered only with that fine reverence which necessarily implies a certain exaltation of spirit.”
“Any use which tends to cheapen it, and, above all, any use which tends to secure its being treated in a spirit of levity, is from every standpoint profoundly to be regretted . . . .“
Comparing the Universal Oneness of All Life to Yo Mama since 2010.
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I was born with the gift of laughter and a sense the world is mad.
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RE: Christian Nation
October 28, 2012 at 9:26 pm
The point is that Thomas Paine argued for having God as the creator (though not specifically any god) should be taught in schools. This is contrary to the 1962 court case concerning separation of church and state in public schools. The founding fathers never intended the notion of God to be removed completely from schools.
Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!
-4th verse of the american national anthem
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RE: Christian Nation
October 28, 2012 at 9:28 pm
(This post was last modified: October 28, 2012 at 9:30 pm by Darkstar.)
(October 28, 2012 at 9:26 pm)chi pan Wrote: The point is that Thomas Paine argued for having God as the creator (though not specifically any god) should be taught in schools. This is contrary to the 1962 court case concerning separation of church and state in public schools. The founding fathers never intended the notion of God to be removed completely from schools.
So wait, is this a debate about the prescence of Christianity in America shortly after the founding, or about whether America is a Christian nation? Even if America was once one (if), the fact that the supreme court case overturned it should indicate that it is not one now.
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RE: Christian Nation
October 28, 2012 at 10:33 pm
Strict constitutionalists seem to only be that when it suits their interests, no different for those who are trying to push Christianity into the public sphere.
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RE: Christian Nation
October 29, 2012 at 1:29 am
(October 28, 2012 at 9:28 pm)Darkstar Wrote: (October 28, 2012 at 9:26 pm)chi pan Wrote: The point is that Thomas Paine argued for having God as the creator (though not specifically any god) should be taught in schools. This is contrary to the 1962 court case concerning separation of church and state in public schools. The founding fathers never intended the notion of God to be removed completely from schools.
So wait, is this a debate about the prescence of Christianity in America shortly after the founding, or about whether America is a Christian nation? Even if America was once one (if), the fact that the supreme court case overturned it should indicate that it is not one now.
The fact that the Supreme Court rules in favor of the separation of church and state by the founding fathers intentions based on fallacies proves the rulings are bogus.
Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
Between their loved home and the war's desolation!
Blest with victory and peace, may the heav'n rescued land
Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
And this be our motto: "In God is our trust."
And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave!
-4th verse of the american national anthem
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RE: Christian Nation
October 29, 2012 at 7:42 pm
(October 29, 2012 at 1:29 am)chi pan Wrote: The fact that the Supreme Court rules in favor of the separation of church and state by the founding fathers intentions based on fallacies proves the rulings are bogus.
I may get back to you on this, but it is obviously a waste of time as you are too deluded and brainwashed to consider that anyone would or should defy your tyrannical, immoral, murdering, sadistic, masochistic sky-daddy.
(Did I cover it all?)
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
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RE: Christian Nation
October 29, 2012 at 7:57 pm
Ok when the United States largest exports are weapons and pornography the whole notion that this nation is christian goes out the window.
Live every day as if already dead, that way you're not disappointed when you are. 
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RE: Christian Nation
October 29, 2012 at 8:03 pm
(This post was last modified: October 29, 2012 at 8:03 pm by IATIA.)
Just because our technology is better than god's is no reason to to suggest this is not a christian nation. 
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
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