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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization?
May 10, 2013 at 9:22 am
(This post was last modified: May 10, 2013 at 9:31 am by L.A.F..)
(May 9, 2013 at 8:24 pm)Minimalist Wrote: (May 9, 2013 at 6:32 pm)Luminox Wrote: I am more inclined to state that politics and global economy will have a negative effect on human advancement, not religion.
I can't imagine what nuance you used to separate religion out of politics.
I compared the definitions of the words and saw that these concepts are not necessarily the same.
Apart from theocracies (which, in my opinion, do not influence the global advancement of mankind on a large scale), we cannot state that religion is the universal poison that ruins everything, based on the political landscape in the U.S.A. or Iran.
We would then judge all the religions based on the actions of a few religious extremists who are affiliated to one of the three monotheistic religions in a few countries.
(May 9, 2013 at 7:53 pm)Violet Lilly Blossom Wrote: (May 9, 2013 at 6:32 pm)Luminox Wrote: I am more inclined to state that politics and global economy will have a negative effect on human advancement, not religion.
How about all 3? 
All of which will also have a 'positive effect on human advancement'... what's the point?
I agree with the fact that politics, economy and religion can have a positive effect on human advancement. With the proper way of thinking of those who govern the societies that have the chances to contribute to human advancement and with the liberal perspective of the people (either religious or non-religious) in those societies, it is (again) justified to state that these 3 factors could be beneficial to humankind.
The only thing that troubles me, is the world economy of the 21st century. I think that the reasons for my worries are quite self-evident.
PS: I should have said "a more negative effect on".
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 11:15 am
Let me throw something out here and see what anyone thinks of it:
We all know what happens with your hard-core religious types when they get up in arms about something. It's something innate in the human species that in theory at least could happen to all of us given the right conditions.
Politics is very similar to religion in that it can feed the same needs of those personality types who can fall prey to it. Witness Mao's cadres during the Cultural Revolution in China. The Khmer Rouge in Cambodia. I could come up with a long list, but I doubt it to be necessary. You get the idea.
So, as much as I have a bias against religion because of all the harm it causes, which is huge, it is far from alone.
Today, here in the US we've got your non-religious political fanatics who just want to tear everything government does down. Grover Norquist's fanboys who just want to defund government "until it's small enough to drown in the bathtub". That's the holy grail to these yo-yo's. They neither know nor care what the purpose of government is, they just want it dead. You know "the government better keep it's hands off my Medicare!" tea-bagger types.
One thing for sure - we live in interesting times. 
“To terrify children with the image of hell, to consider women an inferior creation—is that good for the world?”
― Christopher Hitchens
"That fear first created the gods is perhaps as true as anything so brief could be on so great a subject". - George Santayana
"If this is the best God can do, I'm not impressed". - George Carlin
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 12:36 pm
To hear guys like Ray Kurzweil tell it, it's going to happen a lot sooner than 100 years.
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 2:04 pm
(May 9, 2013 at 12:11 pm)Luminox Wrote: Michio Kaku argues that we will reach a type I civilization in approximately 100 years (based on calculations, which are not mentioned in the video):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9n-tTst-vyQ
Do you think that mankind will reach this higher level within a century?
This is an old idea. I first came across it in the 70s in an Analog SF article.
There have always been Luddites but they have never succeeded.
But the answer is we will have the knowledge to do within a century almost certainly. The means to implement it may take centuries simply because of the construction involved. No one is suggesting it will happen by magic. It will have to be done with physical objects of a size commensurate to the task. Using the power of a hurricane will have to be something huge beyond anything ever conceived. Perhaps to huge to be considered worth the effort. Similarly using their energy before they start would take require structures covering thousands of square miles all over the tropical oceans of the world.
More pratically having the energy equivalent of the entire earth by some other means such as fusion is much more likely. And there the construction cost and time to construct can be put into every day terms just like coal power plants today.
And the motivation for doing all this? We have to find a use for all that energy before anyone is going to build anything. Given all the energy in the world what could you do with it? Convert it to electricity? How? What is the application for it? Making things in millions of unbuilt factories?
As with most theoretical ideas it all defaults to the engineering and economics.
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 2:32 pm
(May 10, 2013 at 9:22 am)Luminox Wrote: I agree with the fact that politics, economy and religion can have a positive effect on human advancement. With the proper way of thinking of those who govern the societies that have the chances to contribute to human advancement and with the liberal perspective of the people (either religious or non-religious) in those societies, it is (again) justified to state that these 3 factors could be beneficial to humankind.
Considering that wholescale slaughter can be perceived as beneficial to humankind... shall we recognize that your stance is infact speaking only for your own interpretations, and that a 'proper way of thinking' is entirely subjective? 
Quote:The only thing that troubles me, is the world economy of the 21st century. I think that the reasons for my worries are quite self-evident.
PS: I should have said "a more negative effect on".
Well... I think you'll find that I don't know any of them. Maybe you'll explain, or maybe you'll carry on with this 'it's self-evident' nonsense. 
Please give me a home where cloud buffalo roam
Where the dear and the strangers can play
Where sometimes is heard a discouraging word
But the skies are not stormy all day
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 6:42 pm
(This post was last modified: May 10, 2013 at 6:44 pm by Justtristo.)
(May 9, 2013 at 12:19 pm)Minimalist Wrote: No.
![[Image: danish_cartoon_protest.jpg]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com%2Fatlas_shrugs%2Fimages%2Fdanish_cartoon_protest.jpg)
Too many shitheads running around loose.
We have managed as a civilization to get to where we are now despite those people.
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 7:14 pm
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 10, 2013 at 7:48 pm
(May 10, 2013 at 7:14 pm)Minimalist Wrote: ]
You are lucky to live in a portion of the world which had equally grisly religious warfare centuries ago and the wounds have largely healed. Much of the rest of the world is not so fortunate.
Fortunately this "much of the rest of the world", even if we were to include the US, is responsible for significantly less than half of the world's economic productivity.
For progressing to next level of civilization it is not the head count that makes a part of the world significant. It is productive capacity and command of resources.
Even amongst the parts of the world retarded by religion, most religions don't much threaten areas outside of its own traditional shit hole. It is only evengelizing religions like Islam, and above all christianity, that directly threaten not only its own traditional shit hole, but seek to expand its baleful shadow to smother wherever human progress may that may be found.
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RE:
May 10, 2013 at 7:51 pm
(May 10, 2013 at 6:42 pm)Justtristo Wrote: (May 9, 2013 at 12:19 pm)Minimalist Wrote: No.
Too many shitheads running around loose.
We have managed as a civilization to get to where we are now despite those people.
Looks like the response I get here when people accuse me of insulting Jews or their religion or their Zionist politics or whatever else they want to use as an excuse to take a lead from those signs.
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RE: Will we witness the transition from a type 0 to a type I civilization in 100 years?
May 20, 2013 at 4:34 am
I hope we convert over to a type 1. I really do. But for that to happen, we need a tolerant society. And that includes atheists being nice to Christians. Everyone has to be tolerant. However is it probably gonna happen? Nope. Terrorists will never stop. You can try to make them stop, but they never will. And once you stop a terrorist organization, another terrorist organization will rise up because you destroyed a terrorist organization.
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