Richard Dawkins obliterates the 10 Commandments.

[Esquilax]

Could we not say the same for Atheists? Just change Christians to Atheists above and ...well, we might want to change cats to something more food worthy?

The difference is that, of the two of our groups, atheists aren't going around claiming to have a book filled with inerrant truths that are binding to all people at all times, written by an omniscient father-being. That's you guys, and given that this is the case the least you could do is show some consistency as to the execution and interpretation of these inerrant truths.

But anyway... Christians have more in common than not. At least we "ALL" believe in God & Jesus! Atheists on the other hand can't agree on whether there is a God or not! Which baffles the crap outta me?!

I know, I know, the idea that someone might keep an open mind and not venture an opinion on absolutely everything regardless of the completeness of their information must be an entirely alien one to you...

And my vote was for Carlin! Much funnier than Dorkins....he better keep his day gig!

And so should you, if "Dorkins" is your best crack.

It's apparent you did not read with intent to understand anything I stated, your definition of what I believe is all you care about, not what I really stated, well that's your choice, dishonest as it is. Because you do this I see no need in arguing any point with you, because the argument is between yourself and what you want to believe I said.

I was more addressing the heart of the issue, that is, that asking christians to detail their beliefs before getting into a debate isn't entrapment, it's necessary but that even doing that doesn't resolve very much since every christian seems to get it differently. Your initial reply admonished Savannahw for not researching the scriptures before asking; I was merely pointing out that this would be ineffective at best.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

You know something I've noticed? Every christian has a different interpretation of what they believe is Christianity.

There are as many Christian gods as their are Christians.

God is entirely subjective depending on the mind of the believer. As there are no two that are the same, the result is a god that has an infinite number of abilities and an infinite number of needs/wants/demands.

But I suspect you already know this

[Bad Wolf]

But anyway... Christians have more in common than not. At least we "ALL" believe in God & Jesus! Atheists on the other hand can't agree on whether there is a God or not! Which baffles the crap outta me?!

How many times do we have to say this? Every atheist does not believe in a god or gods. If you have spoken to someone claiming to be an atheist who also believes in a god, then they have been lying to you. It doesn't surprise me that you are baffled, you seem to ignore most posts that address the points you bring up.

[Savannahw]

Godschild, you do not speak for every christian out there. Yes, you have found what you claim is the right way. Great! I am serious happy for you. I am happy for anyone who is happy with their religious belief structure. However as you have said you are southern baptist, but do not hold all of those beliefs. Would it not be prudent for me to know what the differences are in your personal philosophy, before we got into a major debate? Also You are the one that brought up scripture. It is a major part of your belief system. I know some Christians that think it is just mythology. I know a few who claim god is a woman. I know some who believe in a trinity and others who don't. It is all a personal belief system. That is why it is important to know the details of someone's faith before hand.

I'm sorry if you misunderstood what I was saying, I do not presume to speak for all Christians and there are many Christians I trust in teaching me and showing me my errors in belief.
My belief has grown such as to be hard to even sum up before a debate or discussion and I believe that things should develop as a discussion goes on, this is when one will make a change without realizing it and can then be challenged for contradictions. As far as scripture goes where else does a Christian develop his/her knowledge, there's nowhere else to go. I will agree that some knowledge of a persons belief before hand is necessary, but only to pin down certain things to debate.

Does that mean you will listen to Christians who point out flaws in your belief system? If you can not sum up your belief structure, why are you debating about it? If you make a change in the middle of a discussion, how will the person be able to call you out on it if they did not know your belief structure before hand? Also would you listen to them if they are not christian? Your first statement makes me doubt it. There is nowhere else for a christian to go, well I do know some people who wait for divine inspiration through meditation. However, there are as many interpretations of the scripture as their are people. Knowing the interpretations a person founds their belief on is important, not just a knowledge of verses.

[shoestring]

God has allowed Dawkins to judge Him and all the people laughed, when God judges Dawkins all the people will cry. By the way Dawkins will have no choice about his judgement.

How do you know that Richard Dawkins won't be judged by the Great Flying Spaghetti Monster? What gives your god the monopoly on judgement?

[shoestring]

What I never understood* is why Christians claim that all the OT rules were the "old covenant" or "nailed to the cross with Jesus" so they don't have to be followed any more?

Christians no longer follow the Old Testament laws because they are Judaic, meant for the Jews.

Then why do certain Christian States in the USA have the ten commandments above the entrance to courthouses?

[Esquilax]

Christians no longer follow the Old Testament laws because they are Judaic, meant for the Jews.

Then why do certain Christian States in the USA have the ten commandments above the entrance to courthouses?

C'mon, we both know this one: because their beliefs are inconsistent almost to the point of being nonsensical, at least where the bible is concerned.

[Ryantology]

Then why do certain Christian States in the USA have the ten commandments above the entrance to courthouses?

C'mon, we both know this one: because their beliefs are inconsistent almost to the point of being nonsensical, at least where the bible is concerned.

And they have to be, because they understand that the Bible, interpreted literally, would restrict them from doing all the things they like to do. So, they interpret the Bible so as to allow them to eat bacon and do whatever they want on Sunday (though, they will piously list a few restrictions they adhere to, of course). The only time they evoke those old laws is when they want them to apply to other people (e.g. homosexuals), and why not? Secure in their own sexuality (or in complete denial of it, in some cases), the laws against gay sex don't have any effect on them, after all.

And if you don't agree with their interpretation or point out the inconsistency of their beliefs, what do you get? "You just don't understand scripture".

[Godscreated]

---

I'm sorry if you misunderstood what I was saying, I do not presume to speak for all Christians and there are many Christians I trust in teaching me and showing me my errors in belief.
My belief has grown such as to be hard to even sum up before a debate or discussion and I believe that things should develop as a discussion goes on, this is when one will make a change without realizing it and can then be challenged for contradictions. As far as scripture goes where else does a Christian develop his/her knowledge, there's nowhere else to go. I will agree that some knowledge of a persons belief before hand is necessary, but only to pin down certain things to debate.

---

Does that mean you will listen to Christians who point out flaws in your belief system?

Yes I do, that is as long as they have a valid scriptural point, I will investigate the argument and then make a decision based on what I find, sometimes this process can take years. Yes, I have changed my mind on a few things.

If you can not sum up your belief structure, why are you debating about it?

My belief structure is to large to sum up before a debate, taking things one step at a time is the best way to debate, trying to cover to much in a debate leads to confusion for both sides.

If you make a change in the middle of a discussion, how will the person be able to call you out on it if they did not know your belief structure before hand?

Who says it's I that would make a change in the middle of a discussion. Like I said the debates would be limited to parts of my belief so confusion doesn't creep in. If another part of my belief system need to be brought up as support for the discussion then, I would explain that part before using it as support.

Also would you listen to them if they are not christian? Your first statement makes me doubt it. There is nowhere else for a christian to go, well I do know some people who wait for divine inspiration through meditation.

Depends on what a non christian has to say, I listen to some here that challenge my beliefs, this helps me to grow stronger, forcing me to search scriptures for the truth. Most divine inspiration is revealed through the scriptures.

However, there are as many interpretations of the scripture as their are people. Knowing the interpretations a person founds their belief on is important, not just a knowledge of verses.

Bold statement you made and the same one I've heard here many times, yet no one has been able to back up such a quick and irresponsible statement.
Knowledge of the verses is how one builds a foundation of belief, being honest with what one learns from the scriptures is what establishes a true belief from them, they must be exercised against themselves to show the truth.

---

God has allowed Dawkins to judge Him and all the people laughed, when God judges Dawkins all the people will cry. By the way Dawkins will have no choice about his judgement.

How do you know that Richard Dawkins won't be judged by the Great Flying Spaghetti Monster? What gives your god the monopoly on judgement?

Because He reigns as King over the universe He created. The FSM is only one good fork away from destruction.

[Savannahw]

I don't have much against what you said. I disagree with you. I think that the party in question laying our their beliefs is important. If you don't cool. However when did I claim that a knowledge of scripture is not important? I said a knowledge of interpretations was also important. How is that a bold claim?