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Time For Whites To Wake Up
RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
Instead of me ever even posting in this thread at all, I should have just thrown this book down on page one of this discussion. It says everything I've been trying to say.

It is written by Shelby Steele. Mr. Steele is a senior fellow at Stanford University's Hoover Institution.

[Image: shelby_steele188.jpg]

White Guilt: How Blacks and Whites Together Destroyed the Promise of the Civil Rights Era

Review:

Quote:Shelby Steele, in his new book, White Guilt: How Blacks and Whites Together Destroyed the Promise of the Civil Rights Era, expounds upon the mindset of both groups while exploring our nation's obsession with race. He outlines the interplay between white guilt and black power along with the pernicious effects this dynamic has upon both populations. The author grew up in a time when discrimination was not a shadowy thing. He witnessed it firsthand at baseball practice, and in his father's having to deal with the customs of the southern towns they'd visit.

Throughout the text, Steele combines remembrance with observation as a means to elucidate interracial relations. He defines white guilt as being a complete vacuum of moral authority wherein a stigma is cast upon an entire group of people regardless of what they do or say. In the 1960s, it flourished in whites due to the very real historical wrongs of segregation and slavery. By the end of that decade, due to the growing passivity of whites, the black leadership no longer echoed Dr. King. They became radicalized, and there was no shortage of white politicians, intellectuals, and glitterati (recall Leonard Bernstein) ready to sprawl before their collective feet and regain their moral goodness. For many Caucasians, irrational hate for your own race and your ancestors has now become a mechanism for self-esteem and purity.

When aggression meets submission the result is slaughter, and that's exactly what has happened to the pride of white America over the course of the last four decades. Rage has become the preferred weapon for obtaining concessions from white politicians, and shame prevents rational minds from protesting these tactics. Steele compares the state of many whites to that of Kafka's main character in The Trial, who is guilty of a crime solely because he has been accused. Black activists insisted that acquiring skills and education alone are not acceptable solutions; our government must actively raise them up. This demand is a reason why so many ashen faced elites embrace "diversity" and affirmative action. It allows them to acquire power while amassing feelings of personal superiority.

The government internalized the stigma and dishonor of the majority population, and flooded black neighborhoods with lakes of redemptive spending. That the programs and grants issued were ineffective, or even made things worse, was largely irrelevant as the actions were designed to restore feelings of righteousness in politicians and their appointees.

In the opinion of this reviewer, what keeps racial tensions high in America are intra-race conflicts as opposed to the interracial ones. Most likely, if one group of Caucasians discontinued the practice of systematically defaming all other Caucasians then the strains among us would diminish. The alchemizing of racism from discussions concerning taxation and personal choice does little more than poison our air. When blacks are free from the conspiracy theories and psychologizing of a power obsessed white elite, we will all get along much better.

Ultimately, the best practice for individuals is to treat others as your equals. Modifying your speech and pretending strangers are sensitive to your every syllable is just absurd. The solution to racial problems is not to kow-tow to certain groups and apologize for crimes you never personally committed; instead, we should simply treat other people with respect no matter where they lie on the diversity flowchart. Skin color has nothing to do with personality or worth. Just as one can be certain that segregation and slavery occurred, one can also be certain that the Lester Maddoxes, Orval Faubuses, and Theodore Bilbos are long dead and will never rise again. It is now an excellent time to bury white guilt along with them.

http://www.amazon.com/dp/0060578637

Just go read that book if you want to know my opinion on this entire discussion.
Everything I needed to know about life I learned on Dagobah.
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 24, 2013 at 4:15 pm)A Theist Wrote: Hey DP, when did you blow in? I was beginning to worry. I thought something might have happened to you. I'm glad to see you're okay!

Honestly, I took one look at your racist screed and rolled my eyes and gave up. But I did check in on page 17. I haven't read much in between. Was I close?
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...       -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 24, 2013 at 5:01 pm)Rahul Wrote: ...........

It was one of my first posts in this thread which disregarded the initialising and proposing of political reforms and actions which are racebased.
Yet the acknowlegement of legal equality in a democratic society will not make a the remaining social inequality simply disappear.
Even worse would be to deny that such a problem actualy exists - which is what I acuse you of.
Your insisting on your society being free of racism on the grounds of your own personal expirience in a what is obviously a more progressive part of your state raises the the question over why you are unwiling to at what is ugly in your neighbourhood. Or i there really no more racism in a state of which the governor owns a ranch called "Niggerhead"? Where private white militias can hunt for mexicans at the border? And where social segregation on the grounds of race is still a phenomenon??????
My other point was one of historic responsibility, nations who in their history initialised the institutional discrimination of a people do have the responsibility to learn from this chapter of their historic record. This is done in Germany with Poland and Israel, it is done between France and Algeria, it is done between Russia and Poland, and has recently began to start between European countries and their former African and Asian collonies.

Yet there is no such national soul searching concerning their history of racial discrimination in the South, or at least: I do not see any. And when asking for it - you throw arround pointless and already adressed accusations on German history - hence taking refuge in the shitpit of Godwin. All whilest insisting that racism in the southern American states is nothing worth combating anymore.

And concerning A Theist, I simply accuse him of being a racist, and before the day comes on which I will have a kind word for a racist the day will come on which hell comes into existance and then freezes.

And concerning the "hillbilly" stereotypes I threw arround the person mentioned above. Stereotyps have their origins either in biased notions created out of hatred and fear, or out of expirience with a certain people.
Considering that the person mentioned above opens a thread in which he warns people of a non existing threat against "whites" by a black conspiracy and has previously opened one of the mysogenist threads of this forum and judging by his behavior in general - I can only conclude that the southern stereotype of the racist hillbilly is based on a reality and hence have no problem using these insulting terms when talking of him. And when they insult him - the better, maybe that way he will realise that it is him and his behavior which caused things like such stereotyps in the first place.
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 24, 2013 at 11:14 pm)The Germans are coming Wrote: And concerning the "hillbilly" stereotypes I threw arround the person mentioned above. Stereotyps have their origins either in biased notions created out of hatred and fear, or out of expirience with a certain people.
Considering that the person mentioned above opens a thread in which he warns people of a non existing threat against "whites" by a black conspiracy and has previously opened one of the mysogenist threads of this forum and judging by his behavior in general - I can only conclude that the southern stereotype of the racist hillbilly is based on a reality and hence have no problem using these insulting terms when talking of him. And when they insult him - the better, maybe that way he will realise that it is him and his behavior which caused things like such stereotyps in the first place.

Stereotypes are actually born from schema and then reenforced with various confirmation biases. They are not as rooted in reality as one might think.
[Image: SigBarSping_zpscd7e35e1.png]
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 24, 2013 at 11:14 pm)The Germans are coming Wrote: .................

TGAC, we should start another thread. I'm really done with this one. I hope I've stated my case very clearly in this thread. I mean not for everyone, but enough people. Even if I've failed in that hope, I'm really done with this thread.

I think we're kind of mixing up different conversations going on in our heads. I would really be interested in us moving our discussion to a brand new thread. I think the thoughts involved deserve it.

Would that be alright?
Everything I needed to know about life I learned on Dagobah.
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 25, 2013 at 12:15 am)Annik Wrote: Stereotypes are actually born from schema and then reenforced with various confirmation biases. They are not as rooted in reality as one might think.


Quote:In psychology and cognitive science, a schema (plural schemata or schemas), describes an organized pattern of thought or behavior. It can also be described as a mental structure of preconceived ideas, a framework representing some aspect of the world, or a system of organizing and perceiving new information. Schemata influence attention and the absorption of new knowledge: people are more likely to notice things that fit into their schema, while re-interpreting contradictions to the schema as exceptions or distorting them to fit.

I dont doubt that. Yet am I suposed to ignore the fact that someone behaves exactly like a stereotype and dismiss it as something that is simply wrong with my perception of things?

Quote:Confirmation bias (also called confirmatory bias or myside bias) is a tendency of people to favor information that confirms their beliefs or hypotheses.[Note 1][1] People display this bias when they gather or remember information selectively, or when they interpret it in a biased way. The effect is stronger for emotionally charged issues and for deeply entrenched beliefs. They also tend to interpret ambiguous evidence as supporting their existing position. Biased search, interpretation and memory have been invoked to explain attitude polarization (when a disagreement becomes more extreme even though the different parties are exposed to the same evidence), belief perseverance (when beliefs persist after the evidence for them is shown to be false), the irrational primacy effect (a greater reliance on information encountered early in a series) and illusory correlation (when people falsely perceive an association between two events or situations).

You have read my posts in various other threads, I am not perfect, but am trying to be as objective as possible and I always admit when I have a biased view or when I am simply outright wrong.
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
I don't care if you insult A Theist, but don't demonize an entire subculture while you do it. It's kind of like when you see a black person embodying all the negative traits associated with black people, so you feel justified in called them a "nigger". You may claim that the person is "acting just like a nigger"! Sadly, this doesn't make you any more correct for using the term in a way the degrades the person and the person's race/culture. You're putting a lot of people down for the sake of your insults, but you just have to be mindful that a lot of people grew up in the "hillbilly" subculture and do not turn out that way. Furthermore, you called A Theist a daughter-fucker because he is a "hillbilly/redneck". Think about that for a second. You have no proof A Theist does any of those things and you've attributed it to a stereotype that doesn't hold water. I'm not overly fond of A Theist, I think he's kind of a PR nightmare, but that doesn't give you the go-ahead to call him such unsavory things while simultaneously insulting much of the South (and large parts of the Midwest, for that matter).
[Image: SigBarSping_zpscd7e35e1.png]
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 24, 2013 at 11:14 pm)The Germans are coming Wrote: And concerning the "hillbilly" stereotypes I threw arround the person mentioned above.

The amusing thing is that "Hillbillies" were anti-southern against Plantation slave-owners. They fought against the Confederacy even though they lived in the fringes of the Southern area.

They lived in the wooded hills where agriculture was not worth owning slaves. "Hillbillies" hated Southern Slave owners. They were "Union" men.

So to call what you think are raciest, white, southern Americans "Hillbillies" is kindof ironic.
Everything I needed to know about life I learned on Dagobah.
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 25, 2013 at 12:31 am)Annik Wrote: I don't care if you insult A Theist, but don't demonize an entire subculture while you do it. It's kind of like when you see a black person embodying all the negative traits associated with black people, so you feel justified in called them a "nigger". You may claim that the person is "acting just like a nigger"! Sadly, this doesn't make you any more correct for using the term in a way the degrades the person and the person's race/culture. You're putting a lot of people down for the sake of your insults, but you just have to be mindful that a lot of people grew up in the "hillbilly" subculture and do not turn out that way.

Quote:Redneck is a derogatory slang term used in reference to poor, uneducated white farmers, especially from the southern United States.[1][2] It is similar in meaning to cracker (especially regarding Georgia and Florida), hillbilly (especially regarding Appalachia and the Ozarks),[3] and white trash (but without the last term's suggestions of immorality).[4][5][6]

By the 2000s, the term had expanded in meaning to refer to bigoted, loutish reactionaries who are opposed to modern ways,[7] and has often been used to attack white Southern conservatives. The term is used broadly to degrade working class and rural whites that are perceived by urban progressives to be insufficiently liberal.[8] At the same time, some Southern whites have reclaimed the word, using it with pride and defiance as a self-identifier.[9]

And since it is a degrading slangword for
Quote:bigoted, loutish reactionaries who are opposed to modern ways
I will use it as such until the meaning of the term changes.
It is not me who has to change, it`s the:
Quote:bigoted, loutish reactionaries who are opposed to modern ways


Quote:Furthermore, you called A Theist a daughter-fucker because he is a "hillbilly/redneck". Think about that for a second. You have no proof A Theist does any of those things and you've attributed it to a stereotype that doesn't hold water. I'm not overly fond of A Theist, I think he's kind of a PR nightmare, but that doesn't give you the go-ahead to call him such unsavory things while simultaneously insulting much of the South (and large parts of the Midwest, for that matter).

Fine, I will cut down on the incest insults.

But I will not back down from using the word redneck to insult a redneck as long as the meaning of the word redneck does not change to mean something different.
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RE: Time For Whites To Wake Up
(July 25, 2013 at 12:38 am)The Germans are coming Wrote: Fine, I will cut down on the incest insults.

But I will not back down from using the word redneck to insult a redneck as long as the meaning of the word redneck does not change to mean something different.

As you can see from my OP:
(July 23, 2013 at 10:46 pm)Annik Wrote: Please don't stereotype rednecks as incestuous. ):

That's all I really wanted.
[Image: SigBarSping_zpscd7e35e1.png]
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