Ok I know I know, this has been lifted almost directly from the christian subforum. There's a prat or three lurking around here who never frequent that part of this network however, so I thought perhaps i'd apply the same basic reasoning from the bible thread in here in the hope that our muslim friends almost certainly won't understand why nobody is interested in reams and reams of quotes from one source and one source only, in this case the qur'an. My hope is that perhaps we can help our infantile homophobic friends to see the error of their circular reasoning ways and perhaps also see how any sort of bombastic claim made by myself can be turned in to a 'fact' on par with the qur'an in less than 2 minutes.
Muslims, consider the following: I write on a piece of paper "I just saw a dinosaur down the road". And I start waving it around in a room full of people. Most people say to me "That's very interesting, but we don't believe you, do you have any proof that there is a dinosaur down the road?". I respond by simply waving the piece of paper around some more, saying "this is the evidence, dummy!". No need to explain why the burden of proof is on me and me alone to prove that something so fantastic could possibly be real. No doubt any muslim in here would demand to see the dinosaur for themselves, to photograph it and perhaps even to catch and kill it (halal if you like) so we can examine it more closely.
My scrap of dinosaur paper however carries as much validity as the Qur'an, because the qur'an is basically a collection of 'sayings/diary entries' attributed to one man. It is this one man who has made a claim, or rather a series of claims. To validate his visitation claims/my dinosaur claims you need to examine further; see for ourselves, interrogate, examine etc. To say that the qur'an is evidence for god and that god is evident in the qur'an is circular reasoning. My piece of paper doesn't prove that a dinosaur is sitting on the pavement down the road and the ramblings of one man in paperback (or even hardback) doesn't prove that any deity spoke to him at all.
Whilst we're at it, consider how utterly unlikely and suspect it would be if god only chose to spoke to one man in the convenience of his cave whilst nobody else was watching or listening. Quite the tactic one might use to consolidate and command tribal power in a land of superstitious wonder, yes? The fundamental problem with accepting at face value such a ludicrous series of claims, made by one man, is that everyone will immediately cast your critical reasoning skills in to doubt.
This is why you're not getting your message through; because there is no consistancy to your reasoning abilities. You're unable to understand why we place so much importance on evidence, and why we're always rattling on about the importance of viewing things objectively and not in the way our religious parents/parent culture brainwashed us in to believing from birth. By shouting "Sura 9:13 Ye unto ye blah blah blah blah" or "WesOlsen 3:12 There's a bloody big dinosaur down the road" you're not proving anything, save your hapless ability to recite one insignificant piece of text. I don't expect for a minute that any of you will be inspired to pick up some writings from a range of sources and try to see the world from a different perspective, I thought perhaps you might at least understand why we think your opinions are at best ignorant and stupid, and at worse malicious and dangerous. The qur'an is a series of claims attributed to one man only, a man who would almost certainly be diagnosed with epilepsy or a psychotic disorder were he alive today, or be dismissed as a charlatan/con-man. By making a claim you cannot simply then repeat the claim and insist that this constitutes evidence. You need external sources, and preferrably lots of them from a variety of investigative subjectivities in order to corrorborate an event and establish a rational framework, a mechanism of effect, a theorem etc. Kapeesh?
Ok, go!
Muslims, consider the following: I write on a piece of paper "I just saw a dinosaur down the road". And I start waving it around in a room full of people. Most people say to me "That's very interesting, but we don't believe you, do you have any proof that there is a dinosaur down the road?". I respond by simply waving the piece of paper around some more, saying "this is the evidence, dummy!". No need to explain why the burden of proof is on me and me alone to prove that something so fantastic could possibly be real. No doubt any muslim in here would demand to see the dinosaur for themselves, to photograph it and perhaps even to catch and kill it (halal if you like) so we can examine it more closely.
My scrap of dinosaur paper however carries as much validity as the Qur'an, because the qur'an is basically a collection of 'sayings/diary entries' attributed to one man. It is this one man who has made a claim, or rather a series of claims. To validate his visitation claims/my dinosaur claims you need to examine further; see for ourselves, interrogate, examine etc. To say that the qur'an is evidence for god and that god is evident in the qur'an is circular reasoning. My piece of paper doesn't prove that a dinosaur is sitting on the pavement down the road and the ramblings of one man in paperback (or even hardback) doesn't prove that any deity spoke to him at all.
Whilst we're at it, consider how utterly unlikely and suspect it would be if god only chose to spoke to one man in the convenience of his cave whilst nobody else was watching or listening. Quite the tactic one might use to consolidate and command tribal power in a land of superstitious wonder, yes? The fundamental problem with accepting at face value such a ludicrous series of claims, made by one man, is that everyone will immediately cast your critical reasoning skills in to doubt.
This is why you're not getting your message through; because there is no consistancy to your reasoning abilities. You're unable to understand why we place so much importance on evidence, and why we're always rattling on about the importance of viewing things objectively and not in the way our religious parents/parent culture brainwashed us in to believing from birth. By shouting "Sura 9:13 Ye unto ye blah blah blah blah" or "WesOlsen 3:12 There's a bloody big dinosaur down the road" you're not proving anything, save your hapless ability to recite one insignificant piece of text. I don't expect for a minute that any of you will be inspired to pick up some writings from a range of sources and try to see the world from a different perspective, I thought perhaps you might at least understand why we think your opinions are at best ignorant and stupid, and at worse malicious and dangerous. The qur'an is a series of claims attributed to one man only, a man who would almost certainly be diagnosed with epilepsy or a psychotic disorder were he alive today, or be dismissed as a charlatan/con-man. By making a claim you cannot simply then repeat the claim and insist that this constitutes evidence. You need external sources, and preferrably lots of them from a variety of investigative subjectivities in order to corrorborate an event and establish a rational framework, a mechanism of effect, a theorem etc. Kapeesh?
Ok, go!
(June 19, 2013 at 3:23 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: Most Gays have a typical behavior of rejecting religions, because religions consider them as sinners (In Islam they deserve to be killed)
(June 19, 2013 at 3:23 am)Muslim Scholar Wrote: I think you are too idiot to know the meaning of idiot for example you have a law to prevent boys under 16 from driving do you think that all boys under 16 are careless and cannot drive properly
