Posts: 1571
Threads: 179
Joined: October 14, 2010
Reputation:
35
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:20 pm
(This post was last modified: January 24, 2014 at 11:25 pm by orogenicman.)
(January 24, 2014 at 11:18 pm)The Last Lamenter Wrote: (January 24, 2014 at 8:12 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:"A common linchpin of theistic arguments is the idea of Aristotle’s Causal Axiom, which seems to logically require a demiurgic entity to have flipped the switch to set things in motion.
Aristotle lived in the 4th century BC. We've come a long way since then.
Now wait a second, In my post, I agreed that the Causal Axiom had become irrelevant because of the implications of the Timaeus in most models, in this we agree. However, can we really be so dismissive of one of the greatest minds who has ever lived? The problems of humanity that the ancients pose are still relevant right?
Can we dismiss Aristotle based on what we know today? Yes. If you want to understand the universe as we know it today, I suggest you set Aristotle aside and read Lawrence Krauss instead.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
- Dr. Donald Prothero
Posts: 7
Threads: 1
Joined: January 24, 2014
Reputation:
0
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:30 pm
How long would it take to read Universe From Nothing?
A fine cigar and a good book
Posts: 12512
Threads: 202
Joined: January 3, 2010
Reputation:
107
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:33 pm
(January 24, 2014 at 11:30 pm)The Last Lamenter Wrote: How long would it take to read Universe From Nothing?
Depends on how fast you read and the time you have to read. About 24 hrs? in total.
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
Posts: 7
Threads: 1
Joined: January 24, 2014
Reputation:
0
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:40 pm
What are two other books, besides things from Dawkins, which you could recommend?
A fine cigar and a good book
Posts: 13392
Threads: 187
Joined: March 18, 2012
Reputation:
48
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:42 pm
(January 24, 2014 at 11:18 pm)The Last Lamenter Wrote: (January 24, 2014 at 8:12 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:"A common linchpin of theistic arguments is the idea of Aristotle’s Causal Axiom, which seems to logically require a demiurgic entity to have flipped the switch to set things in motion.
Aristotle lived in the 4th century BC. We've come a long way since then.
Now wait a second, In my post, I agreed that the Causal Axiom had become irrelevant because of the implications of the Timaeus in most models, in this we agree. However, can we really be so dismissive of one of the greatest minds who has ever lived? The problems of humanity that the ancients pose are still relevant right?
In mini's defense (someone write this day down) he grew up with Aristotle, and trusted him with his thoughts and notes concerning the human condition. Aristotle cleaned up what mini had to say and added quite a bit and made it his own, but did not ever credit mini with giving him his initial push, and the rest is history.. Aristotle went off to greatness and mini haunts atheist forums, with one liners and much fist shaking and general humbugery.
Posts: 344
Threads: 45
Joined: May 23, 2013
Reputation:
11
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:45 pm
(This post was last modified: January 24, 2014 at 11:46 pm by wolf39us.)
Wrong thread sorry
Posts: 34478
Threads: 122
Joined: February 22, 2011
Reputation:
159
RE: New guy with questions
January 24, 2014 at 11:58 pm
The how generally informs the why. Regardless, even if there are answers to these questions, the odds are that you will die long before they are found. So I guess the question is, are you comfortable with not knowing?
Posts: 8719
Threads: 128
Joined: March 1, 2012
Reputation:
53
RE: New guy with questions
January 25, 2014 at 12:12 am
(January 24, 2014 at 11:58 pm)rasetsu Wrote:
The how generally informs the why.
Why would that be?
Posts: 69246
Threads: 3759
Joined: August 2, 2009
Reputation:
258
RE: New guy with questions
January 25, 2014 at 12:16 am
(January 24, 2014 at 11:42 pm)Drich Wrote: (January 24, 2014 at 11:18 pm)The Last Lamenter Wrote: (January 24, 2014 at 8:12 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Aristotle lived in the 4th century BC. We've come a long way since then.
Now wait a second, In my post, I agreed that the Causal Axiom had become irrelevant because of the implications of the Timaeus in most models, in this we agree. However, can we really be so dismissive of one of the greatest minds who has ever lived? The problems of humanity that the ancients pose are still relevant right?
In mini's defense (someone write this day down) he grew up with Aristotle, and trusted him with his thoughts and notes concerning the human condition. Aristotle cleaned up what mini had to say and added quite a bit and made it his own, but did not ever credit mini with giving him his initial push, and the rest is history.. Aristotle went off to greatness and mini haunts atheist forums, with one liners and much fist shaking and general humbugery.
And the bastard wouldn't drink the hemlock.
Quote:The problems of humanity that the ancients pose are still relevant right?
I don't know if they are. I frequently wonder, if there were a jesus and everything written about him was accurate, what difference it would make as I am not a down-trodden peasant farmer living 2000 years ago.
This is an industrial age. Science provides our answers. Not priests. Not philosophers.
Posts: 1571
Threads: 179
Joined: October 14, 2010
Reputation:
35
RE: New guy with questions
January 25, 2014 at 12:19 am
(January 24, 2014 at 11:30 pm)The Last Lamenter Wrote: How long would it take to read Universe From Nothing?
Buy it and find out.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
- Dr. Donald Prothero
|
![[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]](https://i.postimg.cc/zf86M5L7/extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg)
