Catholicism

[Fidel_Castronaut]

You show me an institution that transcends time and space, that is centered on devotion to the Blessed Trinity, that makes the salvation of souls, not raking in the cash, its number one mission, that was founded by Jesus Christ Himself, that was entrusted to the Blessed Virgin Mary, that has a litany of Saints, that will defend itself to the last breath for the Truth it knows and loves and you find me and tell me that isn't EXTRAORDINARY.

Uh, any evidence for the bolded parts?

[Chas]

That's bullshit and you know it.

You think the Crusades, the Spanish Inquisition, the Church's proscription against homosexuality, it's stance against women, the systematic cover up of child rape---none of that is the Church's responsibility as an organization?

Listen to what I have said. Are you admitting then, that the Church is so perfect that She cannot falter here on earth? Or are you setting unrealistic expectations. It is the same old song and dance every time. I say this, you respond with the Crusades and child abuse cases that, while significant issues WITHIN the Church, that is, issues that needed to be worked out, just as a team focusses on issues in practice, really are beside the point of the Church's mission.

Not having the church cover up child rape and protect the rapists is not an unrealistic expectation.

If you think it is, you are a sorry excuse for a human being.

[Zen Badger]

Telling us that we should overlook the vile history of the church and just focus on the nice bits is like saying "sure, the nazi's were bad, but they made the trains run on time"

[Crossless2.0]

There is nothing good or moral about looking beyond the atrocities. To still be a member of a corrupt institution is to basically state that you are okay with all the wrongs it commits.

It is called forgiveness my friend.

Who the fuck do you think you are? These crimes aren't yours to forgive. You can either condemn them or tacitly support them. Apparently you think looking the other way while continuing to financially support a criminal conspiracy is OK. Your moral bankruptcy is clear.

[JesusHChrist]

Walks like duck executed a nicely done troll --

Waltz into atheist forum
Ask what the grumpy, satan-possessed denizens think of "Catholicism"
Minimize well-documented horrors of said institution, "they's just playin' bro!"
Stand back and let denizens have their say "snarl, froth, grrrr"
Quietly slip out the side door, chuckling like a duck

[Cato]

Please remember we are talking to someone who actually believes when he consumes a shitty tasting wafer that it literally turns into the flesh of Christ.

[SteelCurtain]

^^ Right!?!

[Clueless Morgan]

You show me an institution that transcends time and space, that is centered on devotion to the Blessed Trinity, that makes the salvation of souls, not raking in the cash, its number one mission, that was founded by Jesus Christ Himself, that was entrusted to the Blessed Virgin Mary, that has a litany of Saints, that will defend itself to the last breath for the Truth it knows and loves and you find me and tell me that isn't EXTRAORDINARY.

WHOA WHOA WHOA!!

Have you not been the Vatican City? Have you never seen a picture of St. Peter's Basilica? Here, let me enlighten you:

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You don't get a building like that without having "raked in cash."

You don't artwork like this:

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Sisten Chapel Ceiling


The Disputation of the Sacrament


Pietà


Laocoon


Not to mention the buildings themselves


The Vatican Museum Spiral Stairs

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without raking in cash.

You don't get this stuff for free. You don't acquire this amount of priceless art for free. You don't get the world's more famous and talented artists to accept your commissions for free.

The Catholic Church got this stuff by raking in the cash and paying for it. They got this art by giving their artists commissions, which they had to have money to pay for.

The Vatican Billions
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vatica...llions.htm

Jesus, the founder of Christianity, was the poorest of the poor.

Roman Catholicism, which claims to be His church, is the richest of the rich, the wealthiest institution on earth. How come, that such an institution, ruling in the name of this same itinerant preacher, whose want was such that he had not even a pillow upon which to rest his head, is now so top-heavy with riches that she can rival - indeed, that she can put to shame - the combined might of the most redoubtable financial trusts, of the most potent industrial super-giants, and of the most prosperous global corporation of the world?

[snip]

Whenever that happened the Vatican did not hesitate to resort of the most prompt and drastic coercion to silence anyone capable of setting in motion forces, within or outside her, likely to divest her of her wealth.

The employment of suppressive measures went from the purely spiritual to physical ones; the ecclesiastical and lay machineries were used according to the degree and seriousness of the threat, and this to such an extent that in due course they became so integrated as to operate at all levels, wherever the two partners deemed themselves imperiled.

The result was that finally the religious exertion of Roman Church became so intermingled with her monetary interests as to identify the former with the latter, so that very often one could see a bishop or a pope fulminate excommunication and anathema against individuals, guilds, cities, princes and kings, seemingly to preserve and defend the spiritual prerogatives of the Church, when in reality they did so exclusively to preserve, defend or expand the territorial, financial or even commercial benefits of a Church determined to retain, and indeed to add to, the wealth it already enjoyed.

You want to talk recent history? How about the fact that the Vatican "quadrupled its earnings over 2011"
http://world.time.com/2013/10/02/vatican...irst-time/

On Oct. 1, the Vatican Bank, officially known as the Institute for Religious Works, published its first financial report in its 125-year history, revealing an array of assets that grew exponentially in 2012.

The 100-page document revealed that the bank quadrupled its earnings over 2011, gaining a net profit of $117 million. The report said the spike in profits came from “favorable trading results and higher bond values” spurred by a drop in interest rates in recent years.

Do you still want to claim that the church isn't "raking in the cash?"

Or are you going to claim that because their money is tied up in art, architecture and other assets that they're actually dirt poor?

[Minimalist]

Listen to what I have said. Are you admitting then, that the Church is so perfect that She cannot falter here on earth?

Your fucking church is nothing but the collective will of the slimy scumbags who run it. From the first phony bishops to the current collection of pervert scumbags THEY dictate what the church is to sheep like you.

[ducketto]

What the fuck is wrong with you?

Faith is what is wrong with the duck.

Do you put faith in anything or anyone but yourself?

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Listen to what I have said. Are you admitting then, that the Church is so perfect that She cannot falter here on earth?

Your fucking church is nothing but the collective will of the slimy scumbags who run it. From the first phony bishops to the current collection of pervert scumbags THEY dictate what the church is to sheep like you.

I don't know where your avid hate for the Church comes from. This is intended for the whole slew of you who have challenged me on this post: your entire argument is centered on sexual abuse scandals. If we go beyond that, which you all can't seem to do and call me crazy for doing, what else is there? It's like 9/11, at some point, our nation had to forgive and move beyond it all.