Garden of Eden was a setup...

[ChristIsLord]

If you want to talk in terms of metaphor, the tree of knowledge of good and evil is not "KNOWLEDGE" but knowledge of "THE LAW" that which we are confined to....the bar that God has set that we consistently fail to achieve.

So what was so wrong with eating the fruit of this tree? Wouldn't we then have the knowledge of this 'law' and hence be better placed to meet the bar of which you speak?

For example: we have rules here. Not many, but we have them. Would it make sense to hide the rules page behind a big red button labelled "DO NOT TOUCH ON PAIN OF DEATH!!!" and have it automatically and permanently ban anyone who tries clicking it? What would that say about the site and the Staff in charge?

God said "you may eat of any tree in the garden but of the tree in the middle of the garden, you shall not eat of it or touch it or you will die."
The rule was not hidden but spelled out clearly; God made it plain and simple DON'T EAT OR TOUCH or you will die. Neither the rule or consequence was hidden from them.

If you had a button that said "DO NOT TOUCH ON PAIN OF DEATH!!! first of all I'd be curious because of my human nature, second, I'd click it just out of pride, just because I wouldn't believe that death was really a consequence. That my good man is our sin nature at work.

[Chad32]

The problem is that if they had no knowledge of good or evil, then they wouldn't understand why he wanted them to stay away. Like a toddler that understands the words yes and no, but not why. Also saying that they would die means nothing to someone who has never experienced death.

[Cyberman]

That wasn't the questions I asked, CiL. I asked if the setup makes sense and what it says about those in charge.

And I am not your good man.

[ChristIsLord]

He went around a small area of the world and helped some local people. Compared to the millions if not billions dying all over the world from illnesses and afflictions they had nothing to do with. Where were the other sins of god, all around the world, spreading love and praising Yahweh? For some reason he only begot one son, at one point, who did some nice things for a few decades. A veritable band aid on the gaping wound of the world.

That's why we believe gravity exists. Because it is apparent and undeniable to everyone with the slightest bit of testing.

The miracles were the singularity that set Jesus apart from every other human on the planet, as a testament to his diety; it was not the reason he came. The reason he came was to take our sins to the cross; a spotless/blameless lamb to be sacrificed.... again for our sins that we may believe and be saved into an eternal relationship with God.

Here we are 2000+ years later and the Gospel is reaching the remotest parts of the world, not just a few nearby cities in the middle-east.
I believe in God and Jesus because the evidence is also undeniable.

Consider how C.S. Lewis puts it....I'm paraphrasing here
Jesus was either who He says He was (God in the FLesh) or an absolute nut-job on par with a psycho who claims to be a poached egg. We have two choices here, and that is to dismiss him as complete nut-case or to bow down at his feet as the Lord and Saviour.

Check out Mere Christianity by C.S. Lewis

[Foxaèr]

I believe in God and Jesus because the evidence is also undeniable.

False. If such evidence existed, there would be no reason for atheism. Everyone would believe without question.

Consider how C.S. Lewis puts it....I'm paraphrasing here
Jesus was either who He says He was (God in the FLesh) or an absolute nut-job on par with a psycho who claims to be a poached egg. We have two choices here, and that is to dismiss him as complete nut-case or to bow down at his feet as the Lord and Saviour.

Delusional, for certain.

[Chad32]

Miracles were all over the place back in the day. People are still talking about miracles today. Being born of a virgin and rising fromt he dead after you're killed isn't even unique to Jesus. I've got a link in my sig to people who shared traits with Jesus.

I don't want an innocent person to pay for my wrongdoings. That's not the responsible thing to do. That's kind of the opposite of justice.

Yes, after 2000+ years christianity has spread around. What it didn't do is crop up all over the place at around the same time, which you'd think would happen from the bible verse that said everyone has knowledge of god.

Liar, lunatic...or maybe legend. Kind of like Hercules. I'm not sure Jesus actually said he was Yahweh in the flesh. He seemed to think they were different people, to the point that when someone asked him what was good, he said why ask him when only god is good. Let not my will, but your will, be done. That kind of stuff.

I do believe Steve Shives reviewed Mere Christianity from an atheist perspective. The book wasn't all that convincing.

[robvalue]

I am absolutely stunned on a daily basis at how powerful cognitive dissidence can be. I wonder if I will eventually stop being surprised?

[Fidel_Castronaut]

Back to what I was saying about dementia, if you are multitasking too much trying to learn too much, your brain will shrink.

Lol, no.

You can do study neuroscience and learn that truth you don't need me to tell you about the brain and how it can shrink and also regenerate.

Go home kid, your trolling is pretty awful.

You already carry this knowledge it comes from your ancestors. If you try to relax too much and do not learn anything however... Your brain will also become damaged and will create it's own entertainment. It has to do with changes in the cerebral microvasculature. You need antioxidants to combat oxidative stress and you need sleep to remove a build up of toxins in the brain. Melatonin (produced when you sleep) will remove the build up of toxins in your brain and creativity will remove oxidative stress as will a healthy diet and exercise. If however you go ape shit on being healthy you will process too much antioxidants and melatonin which can lead to psychosis, and later on in life through the aging process dementia induced psychosis. It's all about equilibrium, but at the end of the day we ALL die. No one is bullet proof. You already know all of this, and if you don't that's what universities and colleges are for.

And I think that's about all I can take of this nonsense. Nothing of what you say is remotely accurate or worth listening too, though it is hilarious. Seems like you've heard 'melatonin' and 'anti-oxidants' on he news or in a woo peddling magazine and decided 'I can troll an Internet forum full of rational skeptics with this! It'll be like, my thing!

Go and get an education man, and work on your trolling.

[Rarthyr500]

Back to what I was saying about dementia, if you are multitasking too much trying to learn too much, your brain will shrink.

Lol, no.

You can do study neuroscience and learn that truth you don't need me to tell you about the brain and how it can shrink and also regenerate.

Go home kid, your trolling is pretty awful.

You already carry this knowledge it comes from your ancestors. If you try to relax too much and do not learn anything however... Your brain will also become damaged and will create it's own entertainment. It has to do with changes in the cerebral microvasculature. You need antioxidants to combat oxidative stress and you need sleep to remove a build up of toxins in the brain. Melatonin (produced when you sleep) will remove the build up of toxins in your brain and creativity will remove oxidative stress as will a healthy diet and exercise. If however you go ape shit on being healthy you will process too much antioxidants and melatonin which can lead to psychosis, and later on in life through the aging process dementia induced psychosis. It's all about equilibrium, but at the end of the day we ALL die. No one is bullet proof. You already know all of this, and if you don't that's what universities and colleges are for.

And I think that's about all I can take of this nonsense. Nothing of what you say is remotely accurate or worth listening too, though it is hilarious. Seems like you've heard 'melatonin' and 'anti-oxidants' on he news or in a woo peddling magazine and decided 'I can troll an Internet forum full of rational skeptics with this! It'll be like, my thing!

Go and get an education man, and work on your trolling.

I'm not wrong... Seriously take your own advice and educate yourself about the brain. You have ZERO knowledge on it. The things I have typed here are well documented scientific fact. Of course it may be hard and expensive to get a course involved in neuroscience. You have to actually have the tools and desire to learn about the brain. You're not a rational skeptic. You're an idiot.

[robvalue]

The thing about science is, everyone uses it. It's simply the method of critical thinking and observation. If people didn't use it, they wouldn't be able to walk through a door successfully or eat their breakfast.

Whether you worship science like me or not, it is real, and it loves you even if you hate it. It's sort of like a logical Jesus.