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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 5, 2015 at 3:45 pm
(July 4, 2015 at 8:43 am)pool Wrote: Wouldn't that make Time traveling an impractical idea? And really smart scientists believe that the idea of time traveling is real.
The trouble with the viability of time travel is though the math says it is possible, the same math breaks down in the presence of a black hole.
(July 5, 2015 at 2:21 pm)LastPoet Wrote: 0.99999... =1
Then it must be true in all cases.
lim
x→1 ![[Image: 0.999.png]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=i285.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fll59%2FIATIA%2F0.999.png)
Obviously that is not true.
The trouble is mixing apples and oranges. Repeating decimals are not exact numbers, but rather representations. In limits, they have a defined purpose, but in standard algebra, they cannot be simply compared.
And no, 1/3 does not equal 0.333 for the same reason. 0.333 is only a best decimal representation. Infinities of any sort must be used with caution and understanding.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 5, 2015 at 4:27 pm
Have you noticed the ... after the nine? You need to work on your math skills IATIA.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 5, 2015 at 4:32 pm
To give you a hint, the decimal system is sufficient to represent all real numbers, but that doesn' mean all real numbers have just one decimal representation. Rationals have the same feature. 1/3 is the same number that 2/6, 3/9, etc.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 5, 2015 at 4:48 pm
(July 5, 2015 at 4:32 pm)LastPoet Wrote: To give you a hint, the decimal system is sufficient to represent all real numbers
Obviously not.
(July 5, 2015 at 4:27 pm)LastPoet Wrote: Have you noticed the ... after the nine? You need to work on your math skills IATIA.
Then it must be true in ALL cases.
lim
x→1 f(x) can equal anything but 1 at which point it becomes indeterminate, therefore, 0.999... does not =1.
You did not address the formula which shows the difference between 0.999... and 1.0, but this is not the thread for this discussion.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 5, 2015 at 6:28 pm
(This post was last modified: July 5, 2015 at 6:28 pm by Jenny A.)
(July 5, 2015 at 1:50 pm)IATIA Wrote: Everything you perceive is in the past. When you look at the sun, you see what it was about 8 minutes ago. Even looking at the person next to you, the time for the light to hit your eyes and then processed will be the past once you are aware of it, so technically, the present is unperceivable.
Which brings me to the world's cheapest and oldest time machine for visiting the distant past. Go outside and look at the stars. The farther away they are the farther into the past you are looking. Won't help you figure out who shot Kennedy, but you will be observing the distant past.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 5, 2015 at 8:13 pm
Everyone knows George Bush senior killed JFK.
It's all in the last "alternative" doco I posted in the "conspiracy theories" post.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 6, 2015 at 1:33 am
@Pyrhho,
Lets say i confine n to be less than infinity.
Wouldn't n still be big enough for 1/n to be negligible?
i.e. 1/n seconds before the present time is the past.
Which would tell me that Past=Present and Present=Past.Which makes me think that past is nothing but another word that describes present itself.
I'm confused? ; _ ;
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 6, 2015 at 2:49 am
(This post was last modified: July 6, 2015 at 3:42 am by Alex K.)
That's bullshit IATIA, the series
Sum_(n=1 to inf) 9*10^-n
which is what the notation 0.999... means (and that's the most important point that requires clarification here),
has the value of exactly 1. The dots indicate that we are interested in the limiting value of the *infinite* series, which in this example has a value that no individual element of the progression can reach. That's how limits work. A better notation would be 0.9 with a bar over the 9 for repetend.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 6, 2015 at 3:33 am
(This post was last modified: July 6, 2015 at 4:16 am by Alex K.)
(July 6, 2015 at 1:33 am)pool Wrote: @Pyrhho,
Lets say i confine n to be less than infinity.
Wouldn't n still be big enough for 1/n to be negligible?
i.e. 1/n seconds before the present time is the past.
Which would tell me that Past=Present and Present=Past.Which makes me think that past is nothing but another word that describes present itself.
I'm confused? ; _ ;
If we think of the timeline as the real numbers for now, and as you do above, we define the present as an isolated single point on that, say 0 for simplicity, then the past (negative numbers) and future (positive numbers) reach arbitrarily close to this point, but that doesn't mean the point is part of the present or future.
The fact that you have constructed a progression 1/n where the individual elements all are an element of the future, but the limiting value is the point you call "present", mathematically speaking does *not* show or mean that the "present" point is an element of the future. It only means that the present point is arbitrarily close to points in the future - there is no gap.
The technical term would be that 0 is in the closure of the set R\0, (i.e. real numbers with 0 removed). It's an element of the closure of the set, not of the set itself.
what I'm saying is standard calculus on real numbers.
The philosophical problem you have is that time is not identical to the real numbers (at least we can't know that it is, and evidence suggests that it isn't) and so you cannot mathematically prove anything about time. You can make the assumption that real numbers are a good model of time, and then you can try to derive predictions about its properties and experimentally test them. If they are falsified, your model is inadequate. Only then you are doing physics. Before that you have little beyond fun speculation.
The fool hath said in his heart, There is a God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
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RE: [Past|Present|Future] Timetravel - Hoax?
July 6, 2015 at 4:05 am
(July 6, 2015 at 3:33 am)Alex K Wrote: (July 6, 2015 at 1:33 am)pool Wrote: @Pyrhho,
Lets say i confine n to be less than infinity.
Wouldn't n still be big enough for 1/n to be negligible?
i.e. 1/n seconds before the present time is the past.
Which would tell me that Past=Present and Present=Past.Which makes me think that past is nothing but another word that describes present itself.
I'm confused? ; _ ;
If we think of the timeline as the real numbers for now, and as you do above, we define the present as an isolated single point on that, say 0 for simplicity, then the past (negative numbers) and future (positive numbers) reach arbitrarily close to this point, but that doesn't mean the point is part of the present or future.
The fact that you have constructed a progression 1/n where the individual elements all are an element of the future, but the limiting value is the point you call "present", mathematically speaking does *not* show or mean that the "present" point is an element of the future. It only means that the present point is arbitrarily close to points in the future - there is no gap.
The technical term would be that 0 is in the closure of the set R\0, (i.e. real numbers with 0 removed). It's an element of the closure of the set, not of the set itself.
what I'm saying is standard calculus on real numbers.
What you are saying^
What i see: ldafijadf*$%*(dfjkdflkadf
So basically i'm wrong?
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