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Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
#11
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
(July 15, 2015 at 10:34 pm)HiYou Wrote: I do not believe the universe or universes could always have existed, because we are part of nature and therefore, if there was an infinite regress of cause and effects of nature, we would have had an eternity to come into being before now so we should have already happened. Self-contradictorily, we would never have existed because a past eternity would go on for eternity never reaching this point. A past eternity of cause and effects is a faulty construct.

I also don't believe the universe can start up from nothing, for that which does not exist can't cause anything as it doesn't exist. Nothing always leaves nothing from nothing.

I therefore believe that since nature can't start up from nothing nor always have existed, there is only one possibility that remains which is nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, being uncreated.

I deem this uncreated Creator to be personal, intelligent and accessible because He can't be less than humans His creation who are likewise personal and accessible.

Has anyone yet mentioned that personal incredulity isn't a very good argument?
Just because you are clueless doesn't mean you have license to make something up and foist it on others.

You deem jack squat.
IF the universe had a cause, there is no reason to believe it is personal and such is the opinion of people much smarter and better informed than you. e.g. Einstein, Hawking, Krause
You have only experience of this universe and have absolutely nothing to say about anything outside it.
IF time came into being you have nothing to say about how other than a bare assertion based on mythology you have been fed.
You have nothing to say about how time might act in environments other than the one you are mostly ignorant of.
Essentially, you have nothing to say.
So how, exactly, does God know that She's NOT a brain in a vat? Huh
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#12
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
Apparently us atheists are the darkness, despite all the evil this guy's religion has inflicted in the world.

Wonder what he's done to actually help people in his life.

Probably "prayed".
Dying to live, living to die.
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#13
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
It's so nice how he reads and responds to the comments in his thread.....
Dodgy
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#14
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
I was hoping to have some sincere, well thought out, conscientious genuine replies, but none have been forthcoming yet.

Maybe tomorrow. I believe in miracles.

I am praying for a miracle will arrive by the time I come back on here tomorrow.

(July 15, 2015 at 11:18 pm)LostLocke Wrote: It's so nice how he reads and responds to the comments in his thread.....
Dodgy

Wayward Pines is like the Garden of Eden but without all the deceit, because there was one place on earth that was safe to live in the Garden of Eden. The reason it was not safe outside of the Garden of Eden was because there were creatures that killed including pre-Adamic men.

But the first Adamic man (another way of saying he had God-consciousness in his spirit so he would never cease to exist) was protected in the Garden around 3986 BC (adding up the ages in Scripture, born 4004 BC) when he was 18 (age of accountability for him) when God breathed in the breath of life directly creating his spirit, and when it made contact with the body of this pre-Adamic man he became a living soul with a spirit (innerman) and a body (outerman).

Gen. 1.2 says God caused the earth to become desolate and waste around 65 million years ago due to the sin of the inhabitants of earth's earliest ages (dinosaurs). The demonic spirits in them were cast into the abyss. In the restoration summed up by the 6 literal days, unavoidably some of those demonic spirits escaped from the deep on Day 4 (see below for explanation). Killing even on a microbial scale was not completely eradicated in the desolation or restoration. You have more bacteria and organisms in your body than there is cells.

Day 1 - there was light but can't see the outline of the sun and moon yet because of the haze being hit by an asteroid and lack of atmosphere from the desolation.
Day 2 - firmament was split, waters above and below, when up came some demons from the deep which are disembodied spirits that seek to inhabit others. One went into the serpent to tempt Adam and Eve. Interestingly, Day 2 is the only day not called a 'good day' because of those demonic spirits that escaped.
Day 4 - You could finally see the outline of the sun and moon because the haze had diminished.

In Wayward Pines it is only the children (Christians, e.g. like the 10 virgins in Matt. 25.1-13) who are able to accept what is really going on. Adults are too stuck in their ways which is why you hardly ever seen someone past the age of 40 ever give their life to Christ. In the tv show, people are brought forward 2000 years showing they will never cease to exist for they are resurrected just like everyone from Adam on are resurrected either for Heaven or for Hell. Rebellious, independent sinners want out of the Garden of Eden just like in Wayward Pines they wanted to go beyond the protective wall.

Those who are rebellious die in their sins. Believers who are carnal are put back in stasis. Consider this like "outer darkness" outside the light of reward of reigning wit Christ during the millennial kingdom. It has no fire or furnace about it. But they don't get to enter the marriage feast. They will be part of God's kingdom again when they have been disciplined in stasis. They will be repentant when released.

The people who are running Wayward Pines from up high in the mountain are like the administrators or angels such as in Rev. 4 the 24 archangels. Once the Lord returns they will take a subservient role to the children of Wayward Pines like the angels in the Bible will also.

Angels as messengers like humans who monitor what is going on in Wayward Pines take up the prayers of the saints (children are the saints in the tv show). If those prayers are in keeping with the will up on high well pleasing to God, they will be enacted upon by God, for praying is praying the will of God.

You wonder why in the tv show there are these people who run Wayward Pines from their lofty positions. Why not wake everyone up with this knowledge? Why create a Wayward Pines at all? The reason is because they all died as the first wave of people resurrected killed themselves because they couldn't handle the truth. Whereas those who were running the day to day operations of Wayward Pines were told in advance 2000 years ago they were chosen for this role and promised they would wake up in 2000 years. They are like angels.
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#15
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
And it was written that you will be gone in 10, 9, 8,.......
No God, No fear.
Know God, Know fear.
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#16
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
Clue 1: Coming onto an atheist website proselytising will just get angry reactions from us. The same way an atheist going onto a religious website and quoting Hitchens at people will just get angry responses.

Clue 2: Doing so is not welcome. We've heard it ALL before. The difference between many atheists and most Christians is that many atheists have read the WHOLE bible.

Done here.

GO away.
Dying to live, living to die.
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#17
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
(July 15, 2015 at 11:25 pm)HiYou Wrote: I was hoping to have some sincere, well thought out, conscientious genuine replies, but none have been forthcoming yet.

Maybe tomorrow. I believe in miracles.

I am praying for a miracle will arrive by the time I come back on here tomorrow.

Ok, point by OP point:

You don't believe there can be an infinite past and/or future because you claim you couldn't be here if there was.
Yes there can.
What is the longest path on the surface of the earth?  Infinite.
Do you exist on one or more such paths? Yes.
Having an infinite path does not preclude being somewhere on that path.
Now map time onto that path and your first statement disappears.

You don't believe that something can come from nothing.
There is plenty of evidence that something can.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pair_production
And your second bare assertion that nothing can come from nothing disappears.

Your last 2 assertions are based on the first two so they are gone as well.
So how, exactly, does God know that She's NOT a brain in a vat? Huh
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#18
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
Oy....
10 years ago I had to hear about how Lost was like religion.
Now it's Wayward Pines.
I sure know how to pick em, huh? Undecided
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#19
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
(July 15, 2015 at 10:34 pm)HiYou Wrote: I do not believe the universe or universes could always have existed, because we are part of nature and therefore, if there was an infinite regress of cause and effects of nature, we would have had an eternity to come into being before now so we should have already happened. Self-contradictorily, we would never have existed because a past eternity would go on for eternity never reaching this point. A past eternity of cause and effects is a faulty construct.

I also don't believe the universe can start up from nothing, for that which does not exist can't cause anything as it doesn't exist. Nothing always leaves nothing from nothing.

I therefore believe that since nature can't start up from nothing nor always have existed, there is only one possibility that remains which is nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, being uncreated.

I deem this uncreated Creator to be personal, intelligent and accessible because He can't be less than humans His creation who are likewise personal and accessible.

1)  What you or I believe about the galactically remote past is too inconsequential to base any conclusion on.

2)  Only creationists believe that something can come from nothing.  Everyone else pretty much assumes pre-existing natural conditions always precede the events we experience.
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#20
RE: Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True
I don't have the interest to deal with this fucktard.

Somebody handle my light work.
Reply



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