Two Undeniable Truths Why Theism is True and Atheism and Agnosticism are Not True

[Faith No More]

I was hoping to have some sincere, well thought out, conscientious genuine replies, but none have been forthcoming yet.

Maybe tomorrow. I believe in miracles.

I am praying for a miracle will arrive by the time I come back on here

The reason you're getting these types of reactions is that you've leapt in with both feet, declaring your beliefs to be true without introducing yourself nor stating your intentions here. You also didn't use the search function to see that this argument has been discussed ad nauseum, and most people are tired of rehashing the flaws in this line of reasoning over and over.

Firstly, you have made the illogical leap from a "necessary" first cause to a sentient creator. What I see as the bigger problem, however, is your misuse of cause and effect. Not only does quantum physics show that your understanding of cause and effect doesn't apply at the scale of a singularity, you're using the cause and effect principle, which is a temporal observation, for when time does not exist. All effects are preceded in time by their cause. That is part of the principle of cause and effect, and if time does not exist, as modern cosmology shows is true at the beginning of the universe, that principle cannot apply.

[robvalue]

Hello.

Your arguments are ones we've heard endlessly before and are not valid. If you're interested in finding out why that is, you can learn from us. If you're just going to tell us how wrong we are and throw bible verses at us, you're wasting everyone's time.

[Minimalist]

I do not believe the universe or universes could always have existed



I also don't believe the universe can start up from nothing


I therefore believe


I deem this uncreated Creator to be personal, intelligent and accessible

No one gives a flying fuck what you believe.

[Aoi Magi]

Hey CL, I hope you see this guy and understand why this community treats incoming theists with suspicion.

OP:
What is your "scientific" basis for rejecting infinite regression?
How do you define "nothing", as mentioned in your OP?
Why do you not consider other contending ideas?
Why would rejection of any of that lead to "god" as a probable explanation?

[ignoramus]

Mao Mao, Stop baffling the poor guy with scientific stuff!
Your professionalism is not appreciated in Islam... Put a burqa on and shut up! hehe

[Brian37]

If you have no problem accepting Thor not being the cause of lighting then it should be no problem accepting none of this needs a cognition.

[Longhorn]

Yep. I'm convinced. Praise FSM.

Seriously, though:

---

I do not believe the universe or universes could always have existed, because we are part of nature and therefore, if there was an infinite regress of cause and effects of nature, we would have had an eternity to come into being before now so we should have already happened. Self-contradictorily, we would never have existed because a past eternity would go on for eternity never reaching this point. A past eternity of cause and effects is a faulty construct.

I also don't believe the universe can start up from nothing, for that which does not exist can't cause anything as it doesn't exist. Nothing always leaves nothing from nothing.

I therefore believe that since nature can't start up from nothing nor always have existed, there is only one possibility that remains which is nature needs a cause outside of itself, outside of time and space, being uncreated.

I deem this uncreated Creator to be personal, intelligent and accessible because He can't be less than humans His creation who are likewise personal and accessible.

---

Look at what I underlined.

Yea, well, it's just like, you know, your opinion man.

Anything and everything beyond 'we don't know'-and that includes your creator hypothesis-is just guessing. I don't know, and you don't either. The difference between us is that I admit to it, but you just keep pulling shit out of your ass.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

What is it with the nutty Muslims all of a sudden? Ramadan getting you guys down?

OP, nobody cares about your beliefs. Nobody cares about what you believe to be true, and nobody cares about your silly religion. What we care about, rather, is evidence to back up your beliefs. Until you come back with that particular miracle, you're wasting everyone's time.

[Spooky]

What is it with the nutty Muslims all of a sudden? Ramadan getting you guys down?

OP, nobody cares about your beliefs. Nobody cares about what you believe to be true, and nobody cares about your silly religion. What we care about, rather, is evidence to back up your beliefs. Until you come back with that particular miracle, you're wasting everyone's time.

I'm ok with it being muslims.  Gives us a little variety to our discussions.  At least, when it's actually a discussion.  I arguably know more about christianity being a former lutheran, than I do about islam (most of which was learned through the filter of the military, IE not a positive filter).  

So there's an off chance that, for me at least, there could be something for me to learn.  Though I'm not holding my breath...

[rado84]

Bla-bla-bla bullshit......

You really, really need to check yourself in there: