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A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 8:49 pm
So I was reading a thread just now, and to my surprise, I found out that some self-proclaimed atheists are "open to the possibility of a higher force". I was just wondering, how many atheists here share this belief/view/openness to the idea.
And a couple of questions to those that find it likely somehow that there could be/is/it would be awesome if there was a higher force out there: What exactly do you mean by it? How is it any different from the concept of a God? What proof do you have for it? Actually, scratch that, how did you even come to think of such a thing? Was it just your own imagination and sense of wonder about the universe or was there something else[/too]?
Skeptics are most welcome too - I actually look forward to someone properly debunking this mysterious energy source that represents a higher something. But that's just me - 
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 8:53 pm
Like anything else, somebody needs to present some evidence. And it needs to be a bit more substantial than Jim Bob got hisself probed up in Spider Hollow last nite, or 'Because Jesus'.
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 8:57 pm
My problem with it is that the term is too vague to be meaningful at all. I'm not open to the idea of a "higher power" unless somebody can explain to me what the hell that actually is. Until then, asking if I believe in a higher power is about as useful as asking if I believe in a bluer sweater.
Verbatim from the mouth of Jesus (retranslated from a retranslation of a copy of a copy):
"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you too will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. How can you see your brother's head up his ass when your own vision is darkened by your head being even further up your ass? How can you say to your brother, 'Get your head out of your ass,' when all the time your head is up your own ass? You hypocrite! First take your head out of your own ass, and then you will see clearly who has his head up his ass and who doesn't." Matthew 7:1-5 (also Luke 6: 41-42)
Also, I has a website: www.RedbeardThePink.com
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 8:59 pm
Most atheists (myself included) lack belief in any kind of higher power in general because of lack of evidence for such. We do not actively assert there is not one because how could we know? Most of us DO actively assert the non-existence of specific God claims because said claims are usually specific enough that they can be demonstrated to be false.
Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 9:00 pm
I hesitate to call it a 'higher' force, but I do think consciousness is not singular. And I'm not talking about 'split personalities' or 'multiples' or anything like that. The corpus callous divides the brain with the effect of creating two centers of consciousness as indicated in this video which, no, I do not consider authoritative. However it does fit with my own ideas and other reading.
https://youtu.be/dFs9WO2B8uI
But I do think the part of us conversing now, the 'conscious mind' is a more recent innovation by the human genome. It is enormously important, distinctive and powerful. But it can be trumped. I liken the conscious mind to the CEO and the unconscious mind to the board of directors. We as conscious minds are nominally in charge but can lose the confidence of the greater consciousness.
So I didn't vote because 'higher' doesn't really fit. Is that wooey enough for you? I don't think of it as a higher power, nor do I look to it for my marching orders. Hell, we were invented to lead. But inclusivity is a great quality in a leader.
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 9:01 pm
Except Anusius of course . . .
The granting of a pardon is an imputation of guilt, and the acceptance a confession of it.
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 9:01 pm
(This post was last modified: August 10, 2015 at 9:33 pm by Excited Penguin.)
(August 10, 2015 at 8:53 pm)vorlon13 Wrote: Like anything else, somebody needs to present some evidence. And it needs to be a bit more substantial than Jim Bob got hisself probed up in Spider Hollow last nite, or 'Because Jesus'.
I agree. But, I think, I can almost get where they're coming from and why some are more comfortable with considering such a possibility than a god. For some, God has a bad, religious stigma about it. So is it that this "life force"(excuse me if I'm calling it wrongly, I'm just trying to be more versatile here) is actually another name for a deistic god, or what?
Whenever I try and imagine what it is people mean by this I just think of some sort of a celestial object that is extremely powerful, or something like that  .
P.S. I'm sure at least some of us here will attest to the fact that we've heard about some form or other of such belief in a "higher force". If not, though, let me bring you up to date. There are people who whenever you ask them about their religious views they just answer something like this: I believe there's something out there, greater than us...". Yeah, I know, confusing, right?
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 9:07 pm
(This post was last modified: August 10, 2015 at 9:08 pm by Mr.wizard.)
(August 10, 2015 at 9:01 pm)excitedpenguin Wrote: (August 10, 2015 at 8:53 pm)vorlon13 Wrote: Like anything else, somebody needs to present some evidence. And it needs to be a bit more substantial than Jim Bob got hisself probed up in Spider Hollow last nite, or 'Because Jesus'.
I agree. But, I think, I can almost get where they're coming from and why some are more comfortable with considering such a possibility than a god. For some, God has a bad, religious stigma about it. So is it that this "life force"(excuse me if I'm calling it wrongly, I'm just trying to be more versatile here) is actually another name for a deistic god, or what?
Whenever I try and imagine what it is people mean by this I just think of some sort of a celestial object that is extremely powerful, or something like that .
P.S. I'm sure at least some of you here will attest to the fact that they've heard about some form of belief or another in this general area of a "higher force". If not, though, let me bring you up to date. There is a group of people out there that whenever you ask them about religion they just answer something like this: I believe there's something out there, greater than us...". Yeah, I know, confusing, right?
Atheists do not rule out the possibility of a higher power or a god, they just do not see evidence for the existence of either, so there is no reason to believe.
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 9:15 pm
One time I cut a fart that was a danger to low-flying aircraft.
How's that for a force.
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RE: A higher force
August 10, 2015 at 9:18 pm
(This post was last modified: August 10, 2015 at 9:19 pm by Excited Penguin.)
(August 10, 2015 at 9:07 pm)Mr.wizard Wrote: (August 10, 2015 at 9:01 pm)excitedpenguin Wrote: I agree. But, I think, I can almost get where they're coming from and why some are more comfortable with considering such a possibility than a god. For some, God has a bad, religious stigma about it. So is it that this "life force"(excuse me if I'm calling it wrongly, I'm just trying to be more versatile here) is actually another name for a deistic god, or what?
Whenever I try and imagine what it is people mean by this I just think of some sort of a celestial object that is extremely powerful, or something like that .
P.S. I'm sure at least some of you here will attest to the fact that they've heard about some form of belief or another in this general area of a "higher force". If not, though, let me bring you up to date. There is a group of people out there that whenever you ask them about religion they just answer something like this: I believe there's something out there, greater than us...". Yeah, I know, confusing, right?
Atheists do not rule out the possibility of a higher power or a god, they just do not see evidence for the existence of either, so there is no reason to believe.
I'm not sure why the need to linger on this point all the time, though. I see it more and more. Of course we can't rule some things out. You can't prove a negative, for one, and also we don't know everything about the cosmos for us to be able to be 100% certain about anything. That would be absurd.
I'm not ruling God or higher powers out either. Not completely so, at least(but then, can you ever rule out non-specific things like that?). It's just that they're such ridiculous and bizarre claims that I might as well say they're false, for the sake of the argument. Many atheists seem to miss the point on this, namely that we wouldn't even be talking about such things if there weren't someone to bring them up in the first place - there's no need to be so anti-dogmatic that you come full circle and actually end up defending dogma.
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