Evidence God Exists: Part II

[Thor]

And this, I'm afraid, comes from a very ingrained inability to accept or pin responsibility on yourself or those around you.

Bullshit.

God is loving and perfect, you don't seem to comprehend this.

You're right. I can't comprehend a loving deity who would sit idly by and watch children die horrible deaths. Imagine that I had the power to cure your child of a fatal disease. All I would have to do is snap my fingers and your child would be cured. You ask me to cure your child. You BEG me to cure your child. I ignore your request without explanation. Your child suffers for a few months and then dies. How would you feel about me? Would you think I'm a great guy? If not, then why would you worship your deity after he does the VERY SAME THING? (And here comes the rationalization that we can't know "God's" great purpose because we're just stupid mortals, or some other ridiculous crap.)

He created this world and He filled it with His children, and He gave His children options to take. The choices themselves are up to us.

And what "choice" did an unborn child make that resulted in being born blind?

A loving diety that created the entire universe? He would know better than you do, actually.

Yes, because I'm a stupid mortal who can't see the value in allowing a child to suffer and die.

He would know what lessons the child could learn from that disease or that problem, and would not interfere when nature took it's natural course and strickened the child.

And what the hell kind of lesson does a three year old learn when they have to undergo chemo, radiation and surgery? And where is there a lesson if the kid dies? And what would you think of a parent who lets "nature take its natural course" and does nothing for their ill child?

No, God did not 'give' the child cancer, the child was just subjected to natural laws and ended up with cancer.

I never said your deity "gave" the child cancer. I said why would he allow a child to suffer with cancer and die?

Deal with the cards your dealt.

My, what a "loving" deity ya got there!

Six year old Billy: "Dear God, please make my cancer go away. It hurts a lot. I don't like going to the hospital and getting stuck with needles. And my mommy cries all the time."

GOD: "SUCK IT UP, KID! YOU EXPECT ME TO HELP YOU? DEAL WITH THE CARDS YOU"VE BEEN DEALT!"

Again, I know you don't believe, but think about it. If an all-powerful, perfectly loving God existed, He would know better than you. And He would be waiting for those thousands dead with open arms when their mortal bodies are shed and their souls go to Him. It is the sweetest kind of redemption for such a tragic end that I can think of.

What a bunch of unsubstantiated hooey.

As for those homeless? They are lucky they still have a life to live and to breathe, so that they may have the opportunity to enjoy themselves in whatever way possible.

GOD: "QUIT WHINING! YOU'RE LUCKY TO BE ALIVE! TAKE A LOOK AT THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAD CHUNKS OF CONCRETE FALL ON THEIR HEADS! I DID NOTHING TO HELP THEM! SO WHY DO YOU THINK I'M GOING TO HELP YOU?"

You seem to forget there's an entire universe out there away from our societal constructs. Who's to say a man can't leave a disaster area all on his own and find a new home, somewhere far off, more at one with nature?

Yeah.... tell that to the victims of Hurricane Katrina who are still living in FEMA trailers.

I disagree whole-heartedly. It is man and nature which makes no sense sometimes.

I agree with you about man, but nature makes PERFECT sense.

[AngelThMan]

---

This promises to be every bit as stupid as your last attempt.

Don't you ever get tired of looking like a fool?

Do you ever have anything intelligent to say besides aggressive attacks?

You know what, Angel, you keep believing that god played in the dirt and made you. Leave the heavy thinking to those who can handle it.

I hope you don't mean yourself. If you were paying attention, you would know that I am a theistic evolutionist, and that I believe Genesis to be more symbolic. The the dirt reference is plain ignorant.

Your arguments are childish.

Who's the one constantly throwing temper tantrums? You're clearly some dumb kid with no real knowledge or understanding. I have to at least give Tavarish props for effort. He's dumb as a doorknob, but at least he always has that Google button ready, and consults his Richard Dawkins bible enough to at least create the illusion of intelligence. But you just spout dumb, unsubstantiated statements with little effort. Do me a favor. Don't talk to me unless you have something smart to say.

---

Do not attack the crochety old man.

I know he claims to be in his 60s. But I have my doubts because he acts like some hyper teenager, going all over the forum dropping little insults. He can't stand still long enough to formulate an idea.

[tavarish]

I have to at least give Tavarish props for effort. He's dumb as a doorknob, but at least he always has that Google button ready, and consults his Richard Dawkins bible enough to attempt to create the illusion of intelligence. But you just spout dumb, unsubstantiated statements with little effort. Do me a favor. Don't talk to me unless you have something smart to say.

Whoa! Theistic Evolutionist - you sure got a solid case there. You do know a scientific theory needs evidence to support it, right? You can't just assert things, even if they have to do with God.

I'm also glad that your enormous brain could grace us with your high standards of evidence and bulletproof arguments. We are all children learning from your wealth of knowledge. I try to consult my Richard Dawkins annotated Bible every night, but perhaps you can contribute a thing or two. My Google button is getting worn out a bit, thanks for pointing it out, I'll have to replace it soon.

In all seriousness, eat a dick.

[Minimalist]

---

This promises to be every bit as stupid as your last attempt.

Don't you ever get tired of looking like a fool?

Do you ever have anything intelligent to say besides aggressive attacks?

You know what, Angel, you keep believing that god played in the dirt and made you. Leave the heavy thinking to those who can handle it.

I hope you don't mean yourself. If you were paying attention, you would know that I am a theistic evolutionist, and that I believe Genesis to be more symbolic. The the dirt reference is plain ignorant.

Your arguments are childish.

Who's the one constantly throwing temper tantrums? You're clearly some dumb kid with no real knowledge or understanding. I have to at least give Tavarish props for effort. He's dumb as a doorknob, but at least he always has that Google button ready, and consults his Richard Dawkins bible enough to at least create the illusion of intelligence. But you just spout dumb, unsubstantiated statements with little effort. Do me a favor. Don't talk to me unless you have something smart to say.

---

Do not attack the crochety old man.

I know he claims to be in his 60s. But I have my doubts because he acts like some hyper teenager, going all over the forum dropping little insults. He can't stand still long enough to formulate an idea.

I am 60 but assholes are assholes and you are leading the league in that department so you need to get called on it.


You don't have a fucking clue about anything you talk about but that doesn't stop you from running your mouth. You must be a clergyman. Only they are so shameless.

[Paul the Human]

Right, because this is real intelligent and mature.

Nah. It wasn't supposed to be. It was supposed to be a joke. The purpose of a joke is to illicit laughter and posting that made me laugh, so... it was a succsessful joke.

I made that joke because I find almost everything you have said so far to be the utterances of a small minded person. Get the joke now?

[Zen Badger]

I've not read very much of the Bible, thank you very much. And I don't think I know everything, I recognize quite wholly I know very little compared to what's out there. But I don't presume that I even can know everything.

Well since it's the book you are supposed to be basing your life on maybe you should actually read it.

Though I've noticed that very few christians ever do read the damned thing.

And, quite often when they do they turn atheist.

[Edwardo Piet]

I know he claims to be in his 60s. But I have my doubts because he acts like some hyper teenager, going all over the forum dropping little insults.

That's belittling to teenagers. Not all teenagers are like that (I for one wasn't like that) - that's so stereotypical. The best way you can insult him is by insulting teenagers?

EvF

[Eilonnwy]

Alright, guys. Things are starting to get a little nasty here. Tone it down.

[Watson]

And this, I'm afraid, comes from a very ingrained inability to accept or pin responsibility on yourself or those around you.

Bullshit.

I know you!

God is loving and perfect, you don't seem to comprehend this.

You're right. I can't comprehend a loving deity who would sit idly by and watch children die horrible deaths. Imagine that I had the power to cure your child of a fatal disease.

Well, seeing as you are human, you exist on this plain and if you had that power, you'd be something of a hero, I'd definitely expect you to do something to save my child.

All I would have to do is snap my fingers and your child would be cured. You ask me to cure your child. You BEG me to cure your child. I ignore your request without explanation. Your child suffers for a few months and then dies. How would you feel about me? Would you think I'm a great guy?

No, you'd pretty much be a dick. You aren't even going to explain yourself? You're such an asshole.

If not, then why would you worship your deity after he does the VERY SAME THING? (And here comes the rationalization that we can't know "God's" great purpose because we're just stupid mortals, or some other ridiculous crap.)

Actually, other than the 'stupid' part, that's pretty much it. You know, you can label it 'rationalization' if you want, but there is still the implied rational in there. But I'll tell you this. Someone who understands God has a much better chance of comprehending why that child died and why that child was taken to Heaven(bare with me here, for the sake of our discussion) than does an Atheist who not only doesn't know God, but doesn't understand Him in the slightest.

He created this world and He filled it with His children, and He gave His children options to take. The choices themselves are up to us.

And what "choice" did an unborn child make that resulted in being born blind?

Who's to say? Our souls(again, bare with me) know better than we do. You've no idea what decisions were made before your birth, supposing God exists, as do souls.

A loving diety that created the entire universe? He would know better than you do, actually.

Yes, because I'm a stupid mortal who can't see the value in allowing a child to suffer and die.

No, because you're just stupid.

He would know what lessons the child could learn from that disease or that problem, and would not interfere when nature took it's natural course and strickened the child.

And what the hell kind of lesson does a three year old learn when they have to undergo chemo, radiation and surgery? And where is there a lesson if the kid dies? And what would you think of a parent who lets "nature take its natural course" and does nothing for their ill child?

Did I say the parent should do nothing for their child? No I did not. But a parent should definitely not be surprised when their child dies of a terminal illness. That's not to say they shouldn't be upset and mourn the child, but they should look at themselves and say 'What have I learned? What do I value more now than ever?'

Perhaps that child isn't the one giving the lesson, but is the teacher...? It's not for you or I to say.

No, God did not 'give' the child cancer, the child was just subjected to natural laws and ended up with cancer.

I never said your deity "gave" the child cancer. I said why would he allow a child to suffer with cancer and die?

A God who believes in free will?

Deal with the cards your dealt.

My, what a "loving" deity ya got there!

Six year old Billy: "Dear God, please make my cancer go away. It hurts a lot. I don't like going to the hospital and getting stuck with needles. And my mommy cries all the time."

GOD: "SUCK IT UP, KID! YOU EXPECT ME TO HELP YOU? DEAL WITH THE CARDS YOU"VE BEEN DEALT!"

Yeah! 'Cause fuck you, Nature! How dare I be born with brown hair! I want blonde hair! I'm going to whine and bitch about it when there's nothing I can do t- oh...there's this thing called hair dye? I can CHANGE MY HAIR COLOR?!

But yeah, still, fuck you Nature.

Do you understand where I am going with this? I'm not saying it isn't very sad that Billy has cancer. But I'm saying he, and his family, should make the most of what they've got. Instead of complaining that nature did what comes natural to it.

Again, I know you don't believe, but think about it. If an all-powerful, perfectly loving God existed, He would know better than you. And He would be waiting for those thousands dead with open arms when their mortal bodies are shed and their souls go to Him. It is the sweetest kind of redemption for such a tragic end that I can think of.

What a bunch of unsubstantiated hooey.

I didn't honestly expect you to understand that part. And that's not a dig at you, it's just not something you can wrap your head around from your viewpoint. Where as I can't wrap my head around some of your viewpoints.

As for those homeless? They are lucky they still have a life to live and to breathe, so that they may have the opportunity to enjoy themselves in whatever way possible.

GOD: "QUIT WHINING! YOU'RE LUCKY TO BE ALIVE! TAKE A LOOK AT THOSE PEOPLE WHO HAD CHUNKS OF CONCRETE FALL ON THEIR HEADS! I DID NOTHING TO HELP THEM! SO WHY DO YOU THINK I'M GOING TO HELP YOU?"

See above about Billy.

You seem to forget there's an entire universe out there away from our societal constructs. Who's to say a man can't leave a disaster area all on his own and find a new home, somewhere far off, more at one with nature?

Yeah.... tell that to the victims of Hurricane Katrina who are still living in FEMA trailers.

Oh for fuck's sake. It's very sad that those people have to live in trailers, yes. But, again, should they blame Mother Nature and the EARTH ITSELF for their bad mood about it? No, the best thing for them to do would just be to make the best of it, and hope for the future.

I disagree whole-heartedly. It is man and nature which makes no sense sometimes.

I agree with you about man, but nature makes PERFECT sense.

Okay, I should rephrase. Man sometimes does illogical things, while nature sometimes does pointless things.

Well since it's the book you are supposed to be basing your life on maybe you should actually read it.

Though I've noticed that very few christians ever do read the damned thing.

And, quite often when they do they turn atheist.

I base my life on the teachings or Jesus Christ, you know, the guy who paved the way for Christianity's creation? And regardless of whether or not you believe he existed, his words teachings themselves stand alone from the man.

[AngelThMan]

I've not read very much of the Bible, thank you very much. And I don't think I know everything, I recognize quite wholly I know very little compared to what's out there. But I don't presume that I even can know everything.

Well since it's the book you are supposed to be basing your life on maybe you should actually read it.

Though I've noticed that very few christians ever do read the damned thing.

And, quite often when they do they turn atheist.

I've read the whole bible from beginning to end, and I'm not an atheist. That's because unlike you I don't take the whole book literally. A lot of it is a series of allegorical passages meant to teach values. If I took the bible completely literally, I would probably be an atheist.