POLL: What's your definition of an agnostic? Atheist?

[rax]

Ok, wow. This started a discussion.

An apatheist is an atheist. As an atheist is anything but a theist and an apatheist is not a theist, he/she is therefore an atheist. So you can be an apatheist, but you are still an atheist. Atheism is the default position.

There are some 'false' definitions, but I've found that only certain people seem to find them false.

Many theists lump all atheists into the 'strong atheist' category even though it's a logical fallacy. In fact, in my experience, this is what most theists do.

Also, all of the self proclaimed 'agnostics' view atheism the same way.

These theists and self proclaimed 'agnostics' view agnosticism as what we atheists view atheism as.

It's a semantics problem. There are effectively two working definitions of 'atheism' even though only one of them is right.

This is the purpose of the poll, to show this discrepancy. There are 'right' answers in the poll. However, each group has their own idea of what answers are right.

[Tiberius]

From wikipedia (bolding mine):

Apatheism describes the manner of acting towards a belief or lack of a belief in a deity; so applies to both theism and atheism.

Indeed, the article also goes on to list several types of apatheism from the perspectives of atheism and theism. Apatheism, like agnosticism, is something applied to belief to add more description; it applies to both belief and non-belief. Deists are almost always apatheists, since they do not believe their God wishes them to behave according to any particular religious or moral compass; ergo their actions have no effect on how their God will judge them (if they even believe it will). Likewise, some atheists are apatheists, choosing simply to not care about religion, or not giving it much thought.

[Violet]

The problem with the "agnostic" one is that I would define agnostic as "one who doesn't take a position either way on the possibility of God's existence," and it was hard to find a definition on that list that would match.

The correct definition is "the view that the existence of god is unknown or unknowable. It deals solely with knowledge and not belief so agnosticism is not a belief and therefore not related to theism or atheism."

Rather, agnosticism is literally the belief that knowledge is impossible (or the lack of belief that things must necessarily be knowable). Gnosticism, in contrast, is literally the belief that things can be known.

Of course, if we are not being literal, then 'gnosticism' could refer especially to 'mystical' knowledge (and whether it can be known)... to a 2nd century christian church... to whatever we interpret it to mean. Strange things can happen when defining words when one is not being literal ^_< 'Agnosticism' is in each of these cases 'not'-gnosticism or 'anti'-gnosticism.

Under the literal definition (if not the commonly used one)... I am indeed a gnostic (in a subjective sense, of course... and not necessarily an intersubjective sense (though I do believe it is also in this case)). When it comes specifically to wether gods can be 'known', I remain a gnostic. When it comes to specifically wether gods can be known intersubjectively (or wether any scientific knowledge of wether gods exist is possible): I am an agnostic in the sense that I have a lack of belief in anything regarding the issue

[LEDO]

I thought the poll sucked. An atheist claims there is no God- period. What was all that BS about unicorns? Also your answers are different sizes. Rule of thumb for multiple choice test is that you take the longest answer. People are lazy and don't like to write long wrong answers when a short one will do. Make the choices about the same length and simplify. An agnostic is a chicken-shit atheist. I didn't see that choice.

[Tiberius]

So according to LEDO, I'm a chicken-shit atheist...atheist. XD

[Violet]

So according to LEDO, I'm a chicken-shit atheist...atheist. XD

You mean to say that you're not?!

[rax]

I thought the poll sucked. An atheist claims there is no God- period. What was all that BS about unicorns? Also your answers are different sizes. Rule of thumb for multiple choice test is that you take the longest answer. People are lazy and don't like to write long wrong answers when a short one will do. Make the choices about the same length and simplify. An agnostic is a chicken-shit atheist. I didn't see that choice.

lol ya. I think it's too wordy, but just don't know how to word it as well but with fewer words. All the unicorn shit was to try to define a strong atheist.

An agnostic isn't a chicken-shit atheist though . An agnostic is an idiot that doesn't realize he's actually an atheist.

[Tiberius]

An agnostic is an idiot that doesn't realize he's actually an atheist.

Right...

Now I'm confused. Your "religious views" seem to use the descriptive word "agnostic" sensibly, and then your post pushes all that aside. I will assume you were making a joke...

[Purple Rabbit]

An atheist is someone with an excessive urge to define himself in relation to the supernatural.

But don't let that confuse you.

[rax]

An agnostic is an idiot that doesn't realize he's actually an atheist.

Right...

Now I'm confused. Your "religious views" seem to use the descriptive word "agnostic" sensibly, and then your post pushes all that aside. I will assume you were making a joke...

No, it's not a joke. Agnostic is not a religious view. So I can ask you, "Do you believe in God?", and if you reply "I'm agnostic", you're an idiot. My response would be "Right, so I didn't ask you if you had an knowledge or not regarding the existence of God. I asked you if you believed."
Agnosticism solely deals with knowledge.
It would be like me asking you "Are you a mechanic?" and you responding, "I don't know anything about cars." I never asked you if you knew anything about cars or not, I asked you whether or not you were a mechanic.


I am an agnostic atheist. I am atheist because I do not have a belief in a deity. At the same time, I do not claim to have knowledge that a god doesn't exist, making me an agnostic.

agnostic atheism = weak atheism