"ISIS is not Islamic

[dyresand]

isis is not islam that is like saying water isn't wet or glass isn't made from sand.

[Cato]

They are a monster the United States and al-Saud created after they had sex because they want to control Syria.

I'm tired of hearing this tripe. Please tell me what the U.S. has to do with an ideology consummated decades before its founding in the marriage of al-Wahhab and al-Saud? ISIS is only its current untethered manifestation.

[paulpablo]

I'm sure there have been threads about this, and I might be preaching to the choir, but I wanted to start a dialogue. I've seen time and time again in U.S. media, even by our own president, that "ISIS is not Islamic." The politically correct left continually tries to drive it into people's heads that Islam is completely peaceful and in no way condones terrorist groups. But none of that is true. It obviously is related to, and inspired by, Islam, and according to the Pew Research Center, many many more Muslims support the more radical tenants of Islam than people think.

Why is any criticism of Islam met with allegations of racism? Why is it not okay to acknowledge that the religion itself is linked to groups like ISIS?

Islam isn't real in a sense that you can say one person is Islamic and another isn't.

Islam means submission to god's will, there's no evidence of what god's will is from an atheist's perspective.  From an atheist's perspective there's no evidence that anyone can be Islamic, but from a Muslims pespective who believes in god they can submit to whatever they think god's will is.
The people who use the word Islamic to describe themselves do it while believing that god's will is written in the quran.
My logic might be off on this one, but I think you pretty much have to be a Muslim first before you can delve into who is Islamic or not  I use the word Islamic to describe anyone involved in the culture around believing in the quran, but I don't claim to believe any of them is following the right way of Islam.

It's like if me and a group of people become catists, we do whatever the ginger cat told us to do last night, I go out giving flowers to people, where as bob goes out and strokes bananas in an obscene manner in public because the cat told him to, who is the real catist?  A logical person might say the prospect of catists is fairly idiotic to begin with.

From an atheists perspective I would think all Muslims are as Islamic as each other, that goes from the Muslims who throwing homosexuals off rooftops to the Muslims who are homosexual claiming the quran says nothing against homosexuals, the shia, the sunni, the nation of Islam, the quranists.
Some people think certain verses abrogate other verses, the hadith orders abrogate quran orders or vice versa, it gets to the point where you might aswell say the letters are in the wrong order and just make up your own words and say you're a Muslim.

[robvalue]

As far as I'm concerned, if someone says they are a Muslim, then they are one. Same with every religion. There is no actual real criteria that could be tested that would be agreed on. Religious beliefs clearly aren't required to make sense or even be internally consistent.

This "no true Muslim" bollocks really has to stop if we're to make any progress, I feel. If you're embarrassed that you're spreading the same myths about the same texts as ISIS, then stop doing it.

[WinterHold]

Give one thing ISIS does, that Mexican drug cartels don't do.
Be my guest & visit bestgore.com , and search for "los zetas". Then search for "ISIS". Then compare.

If the voice is muted, you might get confused between the two.
In other words; the vibe ISIS shines is more of a "gangsta/cutthroat", it's not a unique thing. All gangs practice the same barbarity and brutality.

ISIS is full of fanatics that's for sure, but calling it Islamic is plainly wrong. Blame the gang that produced this version of Islam (Wahhabies), you can also blame the mother of all of that (the Sunni faith). But it's not Islam.

Through Islamic history, gangsters and cutthroats threw their share into the mix, and cooked one nasty meal, called " the sunni/shia sects".

[WinterHold]

They are a monster the United States and al-Saud created after they had sex because they want to control Syria.

I'm tired of hearing this tripe. Please tell me what the U.S. has to do with an ideology consummated decades before its founding in the marriage of al-Wahhab and al-Saud? ISIS is only its current untethered manifestation.

The U.S along with Britain, gave haven for the people who produced this ideology, and thought that Wahhabies would be fine allies.

Wahhabism got killed in the past, the Ottoman empire delivered a killing blow to this stream of thinking, it was never revived until the British empire pledged allegiance to protect it ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Darin ), as a preparation for WW1, Britain saw no problem in allying with these monsters. Even after the war, the alliance is still intact and still strong.

Yes, the ideology has nothing to do with Britain and the U.S. But without the pacts,treaties and official alliance between those super powers & the only Wahhabi state in world, Wahhabism wouldn't have expanded beyond the deserts of Arabia.

[yukapuka]

this whole conversation is like somebody saying "what is physics" having never studied its laws and rules

or even better analogy is the story which comes from buddha about them men in the dark room that touched different parts of an elephent having never seen a elephant and feeling different parts of the elephant and then later describing it differently amongst themselves not realizing that they were all wrong and had only touched a part of the elephant

none of you actually know anything about Islam , what do you expect that information to come from? Islam is studied for decades by the faqih(jursit) before it he can use it in jurisprudence just like any other law system in the world

nobody just goes "oh i know the whole law of the country" and hence is able to deduce what is true and false regarding it

you keep saying "we dont know what Islam is about" and that is because you actually DON'T know what Islam is about

i dont now how many time is need to repeat this before the penny drops for one of you

and the worst things is you keep asking one another as if this group of people here are the only ones left in the world and think they know everything about it , it really is like the analogy Jesus gave "blind leading the blind"

your problem isnt wit Islam, as i said before it is with your ignorance

Imam Ali said once famously

"Our enemies are not the Jews or the Christians, our enemy is ignorance"

and this applies to you right here right now except the part of Jews and Christians is replaced with [insert here your current concluded enemy]

[GrandizerII]

this whole conversation is like somebody saying "what is physics" having never studied its laws and rules

or even better analogy is the story which comes from buddha about them men in the dark room that touched different parts of an elephent having never seen a elephant and feeling different parts of the elephant and then later describing it differently amongst themselves not realizing that they were all wrong and had only touched a part of the elephant

none of you actually know anything about Islam , what do you expect that information to come from? Islam is studied for decades by the faqih(jursit) before it he can use it in jurisprudence just like any other law system in the world

nobody just goes "oh i know the whole law of the country" and hence is able to deduce what is true and false regarding it

you keep saying "we dont know what Islam is about" and that is because you actually DON'T know what Islam is about

i dont now how many time is need to repeat this before the penny drops for one of you

and the worst things is you keep asking one another as if this group of people here are the only ones left in the world and think they know everything about it , it really is like the analogy Jesus gave "blind leading the blind"

your problem isnt wit Islam, as i said before it is with your ignorance

Imam Ali said once famously

"Our enemies are not the Jews or the Christians, our enemy is ignorance"

and this applies to you right here right now except the part of Jews and Christians is replaced with [insert here your current concluded enemy]

So ISIS is not Islamic?

[paulpablo]

this whole conversation is like somebody saying "what is physics" having never studied its laws and rules

or even better analogy is the story which comes from buddha about them men in the dark room that touched different parts of an elephent having never seen a elephant and feeling different parts of the elephant and then later describing it differently amongst themselves not realizing that they were all wrong and had only touched a part of the elephant

none of you actually know anything about Islam , what do you expect that information to come from? Islam is studied for decades by the faqih(jursit) before it he can use it in jurisprudence just like any other law system in the world

nobody just goes "oh i know the whole law of the country" and hence is able to deduce what is true and false regarding it

you keep saying "we dont know what Islam is about" and that is because you actually DON'T know what Islam is about

i dont now how many time is need to repeat this before the penny drops for one of you

and the worst things is you keep asking one another as if this group of people here are the only ones left in the world and think they know everything about it , it really is like the analogy Jesus gave "blind leading the blind"

your problem isnt wit Islam, as i said before it is with your ignorance

Imam Ali said once famously

"Our enemies are not the Jews or the Christians, our enemy is ignorance"

and this applies to you right here right now except the part of Jews and Christians is replaced with [insert here your current concluded enemy]

I know what Islam is about, its about the submission to gods will in the form of a book written in arabic that's supposed to be addressed to all man kind and even people who speak arabic can't agree on the correct translations; interpretations, abrogations or correct hadiths. In other words bullshit

[yukapuka]

this whole conversation is like somebody saying "what is physics" having never studied its laws and rules

or even better analogy is the story which comes from buddha about them men in the dark room that touched different parts of an elephent having never seen a elephant and feeling different parts of the elephant and then later describing it differently amongst themselves not realizing that they were all wrong and had only touched a part of the elephant

none of you actually know anything about Islam , what do you expect that information to come from? Islam is studied for decades by the faqih(jursit) before it he can use it in jurisprudence just like any other law system in the world

nobody just goes "oh i know the whole law of the country" and hence is able to deduce what is true and false regarding it

you keep saying "we dont know what Islam is about" and that is because you actually DON'T know what Islam is about

i dont now how many time is need to repeat this before the penny drops for one of you

and the worst things is you keep asking one another as if this group of people here are the only ones left in the world and think they know everything about it , it really is like the analogy Jesus gave "blind leading the blind"

your problem isnt wit Islam, as i said before it is with your ignorance

Imam Ali said once famously

"Our enemies are not the Jews or the Christians, our enemy is ignorance"

and this applies to you right here right now except the part of Jews and Christians is replaced with [insert here your current concluded enemy]

So ISIS is not Islamic?

if you cant figure it out yet, ISIS is satanic