Should Gender Stereotypes be challenged?

[ErGingerbreadMandude]

1. Where I live we have a serious case of stray dogs. They aren't trained by anyone and they still display typical dog behavior - Proof that in an independent environment they grow to be how they naturally are.

2. Yes, and men display some personality traits that can be considered as feminine personality traits - traits like being caring, being emotional etc. Yes, most dogs may or may not exhibit some characters of the opposite gender - this does not make them the same of the either gender. If it did make them the same then there wouldn't a gender classification. Yes, they have similarities they however have many differences too, differences that are different enough to create a gender variation.

Finally, my point was animals like dogs(maybe there are others) follow a typical male or typical female behavioral pattern(This doesn't mean that male dogs are more aggressive than female dogs or a male dog always wins a physical fight with a female dog) what it means is that they have a typical behavioral pattern, whatever that behavioral pattern is. This is can shown by observing stray dogs(which we have a lot where I live)and their typical behavioral pattern - which they have without any social conditioning.
Thinking that stereotypical human male or stereotypical female characteristics were formed due to stereotypes is getting the concept backwards.

[vorlon13]

I guess my take on 'challenging gender stereotypes' would result in me attempting to drop my sis off at NAPA Auto Parts the next time she wants to go shopping.

I predict it won't end well.

[Homeless Nutter]

1. Where I live we have a serious case of stray dogs. They aren't trained by anyone and they still display typical dog behaviour [...]

Which is what? How do female stray dogs act differently than male dogs? You fail to provide any details - you just throw out general statements about some gender stereotypes that allegedly exist among  dogs. Well - what are they?

2. Yes, and men display some personality traits that can be considered as feminine personality traits - traits like being caring, being emotional etc.

Men display those personality traits, because their natural, human traits - not "feminine" ones. The only people who associate "being emotional" with feminity are primitive, macho posturing pricks, who need an excuse for acting like assholes.

Yes, most dogs may or may not exhibit some characters of the opposite gender - this does not make them the same of the either gender. If it did make them the same then there wouldn't a gender classification.

A what? LOL The gender classification comes from having different genitals - not from behaviour.

Finally, my point was animals like dogs(maybe there are others) follow a typical male or typical female behavioral pattern

In your head - perhaps. Dogs display all sorts of DOG behaviours - it's the human observers, keen to apply their own social norms to everything, who characterize those behaviours as "typical male" or "female".

This is can shown by observing stray dogs(which we have a lot where I live)and their typical behavioral pattern - which they have without any social conditioning.

Then observe them. Maybe then you'll be able to tell me  what stereotypical gender roles they assume - except for the obvious one, that female dogs give birth and male dogs - don't.

Thinking that stereotypical human male or stereotypical female characteristics were formed due to stereotypes is getting the concept backwards.

Right, right - so I guess black people must be lazy, unintelligent, druggy rapists, or else where did the stereotype come from?

Nonsense. Our idea of gender roles has been influenced by our society and civilization at least as much as by our "nature". You have no idea - beyond some naïve fantasy, fed to you by the Flinstones - of how our ancestors really lived - even as far as in the Middle Ages, let alone over the hundreds of thousands of years. What you call "stereotypical human male" is no more real, or similar to actual cave-people, than the Marlboro Man. You have some naïve idea of how people used to live and then you apply this as standard to modern human beings, because you think it justifies behaving in a way that happens to be convenient and easy for you.

For example - the color pink used to be associated with masculinity only a few hundred years ago, while blue was the color for females (which is why it's the color of Virgin Mary, for one example). Then some people changed it - and now thickos, who's only source of knowledge is TV will swear, that pink is "naturally" feminine and always has been.  

And anyway, MY main point was - it doesn't matter where gender stereotypes come from, if they're stupid, limiting and harmful to individuals - f*ck them and f*ck the primitives who would like to force others to assume them, for their own gratification. Our gender stereotypes mainly stem from the fact that human males are bigger and physically stronger than females - and that barely matters nowadays, because we don't rely on physical strength to do almost anything nowadays, thanks to technology and we don't endorse using physical violence within our society as a means of keeping your family in line...

[paulpablo]

[Thumpalumpacus]

1. It can be scientifically proven that men have a higher testosterone in their body which are the reasons for their aggressive and competitive nature.

That is one reason, and not necessarily exclusionary.

2. It can be proved by basic observation that it is not society that dictated how men and women should function through stereotypes. Look at some animals, like say - dogs, no one taught them how boy dogs should behave or how girl dogs should behave - they have no society to impose "stereotypes" on them, yet they project distinctive characteristics that categorize them as a male and female.

Do they? Do you have studies demonstrating that male dogs are more aggressive than female dogs?

Do you understand now that people are the way they are not because of stereotypes? Stereotypes were created because people were the way they were in the first place. You're getting the concept backwards.

I think the issue is probably a little more complex than you seem to think. Human behavior lies at the nexus of phenotype and social input.There are certainly gender-based differences that likely affect the psychology of both individuals and groups of individuals.

However, arguing that because societies, for whatever reason, erect stereotypes, is no reason to laud those stereotypes, or even assume they are correct without examination deeper than what you seem to have performed.

[paulpablo]

[Homeless Nutter]

[paulpablo]

Well you're asking me to forget what I've seen, having been around cats all my life and having family members who have had cats and the truth is males are vastly more territorial, aggressive, fight way more, spray their scent all over their territory and so on, their muscle structure is way more enhanced than a females.

I'm in work right now so I don't have the best access to scientific info about dog aggression. Although I'm pretty sure at least one of those links I provided did include statistics about aggression in dogs

I'm on my phone right now and I can't figure out how to copy and paste links easily, but a quick Google search shows research which says gender does make a difference on wether a dog is more or less likely to be aggressive, males being more aggressive.

[Losty]

I grew up on a farm. I've never seen what you're saying with cats or dogs. Their aggression tends to vary on individual basis. Male peacocks tend to be more aggressive than females, and female ostrich tend to be more aggressive than males. None of this means anything though. Personal experience doesn't count for much by way of evidence.

[Longhorn]

So let me get this straight.

When it comes to the discrimination of women in the workplace, studies are just opinions and testimonies are not evidence...

...but if we're talking about cats, fuck research and take my personal experience as conclusive proof?