Do You Believe In Love?

[Cecco]

Do you believe in love?

If you do, why so? Like god, It cannot be proven that love exists. Like god, love is just a manmade concept. Science tells us that what we experience as love is just brain chemicals giving us a warm and fuzzy feeling. Surely, if you say god doesn't exist, and if you are to be consistent with your cynicism throughout all avenues of thought, you would have to conclude that love does not exist.

In which case love is something that can only be believed in. For it to exist you have to show faith.

Do you denounce god and criticise others for believing in him/her/it, but at the same time tell friends and family that you love them? Yes? What a hypocrite you are!

You may say 'yes love exists! i can feel it!' but you are not feeling love. To use the accurate language of the athiest, what you are feeling, if you are to be scientific, is a chemical reaction. And anyway, empirical knowledge is never absolute. It is all perception. All illusion.

You may say 'but love is a harmless thing to believe in!' but i would argue that it has broken more people than religion. Am i right guys? Don't tell me you've never been there. After all, isn't it the feeling of love for Jesus (and the rest), rather than jesus himself, which motivates the mayhem in his name?

So, you cynical lot, how far do you take this logical attitude; Do you denounce love? Or do you allow yourself that one leap of faith?

[Edwardo Piet]

Love is an emotion that I and other human beings (and I believe some other conscious creatures) can experience. It's not just a concept it also exists as brain chemicals.

You may say 'yes love exists! i can feel it!' but you are not feeling love. To use the accurate language of the athiest, what you are feeling, if you are to be scientific, is a chemical reaction.

But that is love. Love is an emotion and emotions are chemical.

EvF

[Cecco]

Yep. I said as much as that already. But is it real? Is it it's own thing, or merely a chemical reaction?

[Paul the Human]

I believe that 'love' is the name we give to the chemical reaction you mentioned. Emotions are chemical reactions in the brain and 'love' is the name of one of those emotions. Totally scientific. Are you saying that, since emotions are nothing more than the result of biological functions... they do not exist?

I love my wife. That is how I feel about her. It is caused by a chemical reaction in my brain that effects my brain's functions, combined with familiarity, comfort, and security. That is what love is. It doesn't exist in a tangible way, no... it exists as the brain's interpretation of it's own biological activity.

[Edwardo Piet]

Is it it's own thing, or merely a chemical reaction?

"The chemical reaction" is the emotion of love - I don't see what the problem is. Chemical reactions are real, love is a chemical reaction, love is real.

EvF

[Cecco]

So if it doesn't exist in a tangible way, paul, surely it doesn't truly exist? That is what you would say about god, is it not?

You can take your last paragraph and swap loving your wife for jesus and you get:

'i love jesus. that is how i feel about him. it is caused by a chemical reaction in my brain that effects my brain's functions, combined with familiarity, comfort and security. That is what jesus is. He doesn't exist in a tangible way, no... he exists as the brain's interpretation of it's own biological activity.

[Edwardo Piet]

So there is no problem here. Love exists because it's an emotion and emotions exist as chemical reactions.

EvF

[Paul the Human]

I get what you're saying, but I don't see them as the same thing. That doesn't make Jesus a real, physical person... it makes him one that exists only within my mind, i.e. imaginary. Emotions are a function of the brain and exist as such. They are not tangible in that you can carry them in your pocket, no. They exist as detectable 'feelings', which are caused by natural brain function.

You might say that, if I believe in god, then god exists within my mind, but that is not the case. If I believed in god, he would only exist as a concept within my mind. That would not make god himself exist independently from me. With emotions, there is no claim that they exist independently of the brain... they are a function of the brain. Those chemical reactions we have named 'emotion' exist.

[Cecco]

love is not the chemical reaction. love is just a name we give the feeling the reaction brings us. love is an abstract concept, is it not? nobody defines love as a chemical reaction. the chemica reaction is the chemical reaction. love is a name for a feeling created by man. it doesn't exist as a thing.

[Paul the Human]

Agreed. But, I am not claiming that love exists as anything but a chemical reaction in the brain. That chemical reaction exists. We name it 'love'. (EDIT: Correction... we name the feeling caused by that chemical reaction love. It exists as such, nothing more, nothing less.)