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RE: Physical idealism
May 17, 2016 at 9:57 pm
(This post was last modified: May 17, 2016 at 9:59 pm by bennyboy.)
(May 17, 2016 at 1:54 pm)Rhythm Wrote: MP3 files -aren't- independent of a specific medium........but who cares, right? Not that this inaccuracy is, ultimately, the reason I find this unsatisfying no matter how many times you repeat it. Nothing about being independent of a particular medium makes it sensible to call something an idea, physical or otherwise. MP3 files ARE independent of a specific medium. They can be carried on CDs, in RAM, or in seashells arranged on a beach. You seem not to understand what "specific" means.
Quote:Ideas of bullets don't bring bullets into reality...so I guess the idea of a bullet isn't a formative principle after all -by your own definition.
Bullets don't spontaneously erupt out of a pool of chemicals. Nor did I say that anything is the expression of a single formative principle. The fact is that there is a representation of what a bullet is that is not a bullet, and that serves as a template for the creation of actual bullets.
Quote:You left out a third option...which I would combine with your first. You have an innaccurate view of MP3 files, evolution, and small arms manufacturing...and difficulty describing whatever it is you're thinking that isn't actually related to or found within any of those examples.
If you want to challenge my knowledge of any of these things, go ahead. With regard to MP3 files, I can guarantee, 100% chance, that I understand what they are and how they work much better than you do, since I've programmed with them pretty extensively.
But while my interest in the OP was sincere, my interest in this paint-drying-watching discussion with you is spent. I guess that's it until the next time. /out
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RE: Physical idealism
May 18, 2016 at 6:26 am
(This post was last modified: May 18, 2016 at 7:51 am by The Grand Nudger.)
All an MP3 is, is a standard format for -digital- audio. But go ahead, continue. 
Quote:Quote:Ideas of bullets don't bring bullets into reality...so I guess the idea of a bullet isn't a formative principle after all -by your own definition.
Bullets don't spontaneously erupt out of a pool of chemicals. Nor did I say that anything is the expression of a single formative principle. The fact is that there is a representation of what a bullet is that is not a bullet, and that serves as a template for the creation of actual bullets.
OFC they don't spontaneously erupt out of pools of chemicals, no one said they did. I only said that the "idea of a bullet" doesn't do what -you- claimed formative principles do. They also aren't brought into reality by any -number- of ideas...as you've described ideas.so there's simply no way the proposition -can be- true. Find an example that works, at least by reference to your own statements.
Quote:If you want to challenge my knowledge of any of these things, go ahead. With regard to MP3 files, I can guarantee, 100% chance, that I understand what they are and how they work much better than you do, since I've programmed with them pretty extensively.
Programmers often don't know how or why the things they work with, work. More of a linguist, as a programmer, than a mechanic...wouldn't you agree? I'd like to see you program an MP3 with seashells, for example. That'd be a neat trick. I;m sure you can draw a picture of an mp3 file...but my daughters can draw a picture of the sun....does that mean that the sun is also independent of it's medium, a specific medium, it;s mechanism, or a mechanism?
Quote:But while my interest in the OP was sincere, my interest in this paint-drying-watching discussion with you is spent. I guess that's it until the next time. /out
Till next time. o7 
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RE: Physical idealism
May 20, 2016 at 4:53 am
(May 7, 2016 at 9:32 am)bennyboy Wrote: I was reading this:
http://edition.cnn.com/2016/05/04/health...index.html
And it got me to thinking. . . there must be a genetic pattern for a "toe," and then a counter of some type. So you could arbitrarily (I assume) program a DNA sequence to have any number of toes or fingers, and yet, magically, they "turn out." The baby's toes all look good, he's just got the wrong number of them.
In other words, the human body actually isn't completely represented in the DNA, but as a sequence of instructions ABOUT a human body-- for example, how many toes it should have.
Stuff to think about.
Regarding the OP, I'm fairly certain it is more complicated than merely "re-programming" the DNA sequence. There are factors and signals external to the genetic code that direct gene expression (see: Epigenetics). In other words, you can alter the genetic expression of cells and organisms without any change to the DNA sequence itself, but rather to the non-genetic "codes" of the DNA strand (e.g. methyl groups, DNA packaging and coiing, etc.), and these changes can be passed on to the cell's progeny. I don't have the best understanding of the mechanisms, but I'm fairly certain there are also non-base-pair "codes" on the DNA molecule itself.
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