Trump now tied with Clition nationally according to Real Clear Poltics average

[Thumpalumpacus]

China invaded Vietnam because Vietnam invaded their friend Cambodia first. China tried to mediate peace talks - but they failed. So, in the end, they invaded Vietnam (which had already invaded Cambodia which they saw as being too pro-China; this being the time of the beginning of the market reforms in China). Pol Pot was an opportunist and noob, so he gets no sympathy from me. But if your friend was being bullied, wouldn't you want to protect them? Are you seriously suggesting you wouldn't protect a friend who was being beaten up?

China supported Pol Pot. What more do you need to know? Do you need me to spell this out for you?

Neither the United States or China has ever really adhered to the Geneva Convention. And if we're to bring up centuries worth of misdeeds then we can talk about the American Indians, the Philippines and Banana Wars, etc. What I'm saying is the United States has killed more people than China - especially if we limit ourselves to the post Cold War period.

You missed the point -- it is you bringing up centuries of American misdeeds, while not doing the same for the Chinese, yet acting as if you're making an equal comparison. You're not. You're cherry-picking history, is what you're doing.

There is a long list of countries that have done nothing to deserve being interfered with by the United States - far longer than any list of Chinese interference. Call me a Chinese apologist if you want - I will proudly endorse that title -

That says it all, then. Where do you live, anyway? Europe? South Africa?

I'd be my ass and my right arm you don't live in Tibet. Yours is an opinion easy to proffer from the comfort of your desk chair.

but the United States is a country of never ending war. Obama has been ordering so many bombs to be dropped the military has been running out of bombs in recent months. You have to admit the Oval Office think lives of the people of the third world are worth less than those of Americans.

The alternative explanation, which seems to have escaped your scope of thought, is that the US military has not maintained its bomb factories to the extent that would allow for ongoing offensive operations.

Of course, that doesn't comport with your view of America the Evil, so no doubt you'll discard it.

I'm done with this conversation. I had thought I was going to get interesting discussion on foreign affairs, not simple-minded polemic from someone crippled by bias.

Good day.

[ReptilianPeon]

Half of my family comes from Italy. When the Americans landed in Italy in World War Two they colluded with the Mafia. The fucking Mafia! The Mafia is a curse on the country that I love and the Americans worked with them because "the end justifies the means" and "the enemy of the enemy is my friend". For all his ills, at least initially, Benito Mussolini tried to eradicate the Mafia.

The Americans helped the Mafia to become strong again - and they were useful allies against the Italian Communist Party which consistently came second in post-war Italian elections (e.g. Mafia bosses even stood for election after the war). The Mafia stain that Italy cannot seem to get rid of and Americans worked with them! Maybe when your country is cursed by criminality supported by the Americans you'll be as bitter as I am. Now maybe you understand why I am so bitter. 

Italy has suffered greatly because of the Mafia. And, just to add, I don't really want to defend the cultural revolution - I am not a Maoist - but I was trying to emphasize American imperialism. And, look American  domestic policy is pretty bad too - they have more people in prison than even China does.

[KUSA]

That would play right into his hands. He would have his opponents admitting that Bill is a rapist.

That argument has already been laid, and dismissed:

No, it doesn't.  All she has to say is, "If he thought my husband was a rapist, why did he invite us at all?" No admission is necessary to skewer him on that.

It's a wash.

It pays to read before you post, y'know?

I'm so glad you pointed that out.

[ReptilianPeon]

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China invaded Vietnam because Vietnam invaded their friend Cambodia first. China tried to mediate peace talks - but they failed. So, in the end, they invaded Vietnam (which had already invaded Cambodia which they saw as being too pro-China; this being the time of the beginning of the market reforms in China). Pol Pot was an opportunist and noob, so he gets no sympathy from me. But if your friend was being bullied, wouldn't you want to protect them? Are you seriously suggesting you wouldn't protect a friend who was being beaten up?

China supported Pol Pot. What more do you need to know?  Do you need me to spell this out for you?

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How is this any different from the United States supporting West Pakistan as it committed genocide in East Pakistan in 1971? Like China, the United States, wanted to protect its interests. India invaded Bangladesh, like Vietnam invaded Cambodia. And, like China against Vietnam, West Pakistan declared war against India. It seems to go over peoples' heads that Henry Kissinger, like Pol Pot, is a criminal.

[account_inactive]

America will never be charged with any war crimes as long as they basically control the world.

[ReptilianPeon]

America will never be charged with any war crimes as long as they basically control the world.

If you disagreed with the constant war, they had COINTELPRO, the American version of the KGB - until it was exposed for what it was. Turns out the FBI doesn't just investigate criminality. Today the NSA takes up the role COINTELPRO once held.

[Thumpalumpacus]

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China supported Pol Pot. What more do you need to know?  Do you need me to spell this out for you?

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How is this any different from the United States supporting West Pakistan as it committed genocide in East Pakistan in 1971? Like China, the United States, wanted to protect its interests. India invaded Bangladesh, like Vietnam invaded Cambodia. And, like China against Vietnam, West Pakistan declared war against India. It seems to go over peoples' heads that Henry Kissinger, like Pol Pot, is a criminal.

I know I said I'd quit discussing this with you, but you're undermining your own point here, I thought you'd like to know. If you detest American practices so much, what history do you have to go on that China would be more beneficent?

That's right, you have none. Hence my comments upthread about your bias. Feel free to PM them to me if you have something demonstrating Chinese respect for your outspoken values. Me, I think you yourself would probably be listed for a round-up what with your posting ... or perhaps you might fall silent for fear? IDK.

Me, I look forward to the day when my American tax dollars don't invade little countries ... or defend ingrates, for that matter. I've made no bones about the imperfection of my own country's foreign policy, yet rather than pursue discussion your seem to prefer more polemic. Not my horse, I ain't gonna ride it. Vent your little heart out.

Your table, I'm out now. Really.

[KUSA]

Trumpalumpacus

[Aractus]

China has done more wrong.  Just look at what they fucking did to their own people in Tiananmen Square.  Their record on human rights is downright atrocious.   And Russia isn't any goddamn better.

No way is that even remotely true in recent History. At least China tries to keep the peace and build positive relations with their neighbours (eg. North Korea); look at how the USA treats their neighbours such as Cuba! China doesn't go around instigating war and creating instability in the middle-east, and supporting Israel which leads to displaced peoples, economic and social stagnation, and of course the rise of extremist groups to replace the dispelled regimes.

The USA has just as many human rights abuses. The UN has found that their prisons routinely breach the Convention on torture (and specifically holding people in solitary confinement), and they're still the only developed country in the world not committed to providing equal access to healthcare; which is a key principle under the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights (Articles 21.2, 25).

[ReptilianPeon]

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China has done more wrong.  Just look at what they fucking did to their own people in Tiananmen Square.  Their record on human rights is downright atrocious.   And Russia isn't any goddamn better.

No way is that even remotely true in recent History. At least China tries to keep the peace and build positive relations with their neighbours (eg. North Korea); look at how the USA treats their neighbours such as Cuba! China doesn't go around instigating war and creating instability in the middle-east, and supporting Israel which leads to displaced peoples, economic and social stagnation, and of course the rise of extremist groups to replace the dispelled regimes.

The USA has just as many human rights abuses. The UN has found that their prisons routinely breach the Convention on torture (and specifically holding people in solitary confinement), and they're still the only developed country in the world not committed to providing equal access to healthcare; which is a key principle under the UN Universal Declaration of Human Rights (Articles 21.2, 25).

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It gets worse. Not only did the Nixon Administration (e.g. Hilary's friend Henry) turn a blind eye to genocide in East Pakistan, they threatened India with the nuclear aircraft carrier the USS Enterprise when it became clear West Pakistan was losing the Bangladesh Liberation War. The Soviets responded by sending ships of their own to the Bay Of Bengal. The Administration even encouraged China to mobilize its armed forces along its border with India and increase the flow of weapons to the genocidal military of (West) Pakistan. That's a recipe for World War Three if ever I saw one.