Making the case for Islam.

[WinterHold]

The Wikipedia article lists Quran verses related to the ninety-nine supposed names of Aljah and some have more support than others.  What I don't understand is why  some are duplicates or are made redundant by others. I mentioned other previously, but you also have Al-Hadi (the guide) which is basically the same as Ar-Rashid (The Guide to the Right Path).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_God_in_Islam

I pick one at random I'm not sure how that Quran verse relates to that name (this the only verse that related to A-Fattah):

Al-Fattah is supposedly supported by (only) Quran 34:26

"Say: "Our Lord will gather us together and will in the end decide the matter between us (and you) in truth and justice: and He is the one to decide, the One Who knows all.""

Where in that verse is the name of Allah? I don't see any names there. Shouldn't it say "The Victory Giver".  Am I missing something?

I also notice name Al-Wahhab and I think that's curious. So Abdul Wahaab is named after one of the names of Allah?

In Saudi Arabia, you can't believe the amounts of money the natives pay for certain "blessed,knowledgabla sheikhs" who work as "demon busters" and fight "black magic". Sunnah are so messed up indeed; all Muslims are TBH xD

It's like people and their fortune tellers. The supposed psychic mediums are good at judging behavior and only speak with vague language. They aren't in contact with "spirits".

Parents probably convince their children they are possessed by Jinn if they are too rebellious. Then you have to go and see the crazy Sheikh. e.g.

Parents, church members beat teen to death, injured brother while trying to get them to ‘confess sins’ at N.Y. church: cops

That list is not right; it points to verses which have no mention of the specified name, you also have:

Al-Majid
Al-Wajid

The 99 comes directly from the Hadith:

http://ustazkamal3449.blogspot.com/2011/05/are-names-of-allah-limited-to-99-names.html

But the majority of Muslim scholars do believe that the names exceed 99. 

Personally, when I pray, the name I call depends on the attribute/quality I want to praise; that's why I stick to what is mentioned in the Quran in terms of names. I can't know why Muslim don't just stick to their holy book in those regards.

Wahhab is in the Quran, it's included about 3 times. 

"Abd" means "slaves", so "Abd Allah/Abdullah" means "the slave of Allah", "Abd Al Rahman/Abdulrahman" means "the slave of the merciful"...etc. 

Our "Abd Al Wahhab" is called Mohammed; that's his personal name, Abdul Wahhab is his dad, "Mohammed, the son of, Abd Al Wahhab".
Ibn=the son of.

These exorcism stuff just make wonder. Yep, psychological mess is translated as "demon possession", and when people don't agree with you there's always the "dark influence" charge to  throw at your enemies.

[Brian37]

The Wikipedia article lists Quran verses related to the ninety-nine supposed names of Aljah and some have more support than others.  What I don't understand is why  some are duplicates or are made redundant by others. I mentioned other previously, but you also have Al-Hadi (the guide) which is basically the same as Ar-Rashid (The Guide to the Right Path).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_God_in_Islam

I pick one at random I'm not sure how that Quran verse relates to that name (this the only verse that related to A-Fattah):

Al-Fattah is supposedly supported by (only) Quran 34:26

"Say: "Our Lord will gather us together and will in the end decide the matter between us (and you) in truth and justice: and He is the one to decide, the One Who knows all.""

Where in that verse is the name of Allah? I don't see any names there. Shouldn't it say "The Victory Giver".  Am I missing something?

I also notice name Al-Wahhab and I think that's curious. So Abdul Wahaab is named after one of the names of Allah?


It's like people and their fortune tellers. The supposed psychic mediums are good at judging behavior and only speak with vague language. They aren't in contact with "spirits".

Parents probably convince their children they are possessed by Jinn if they are too rebellious. Then you have to go and see the crazy Sheikh. e.g.

Parents, church members beat teen to death, injured brother while trying to get them to ‘confess sins’ at N.Y. church: cops

That list is not right; it points to verses which have no mention of the specified name, you also have:

Al-Majid
Al-Wajid

The 99 comes directly from the Hadith:

http://ustazkamal3449.blogspot.com/2011/05/are-names-of-allah-limited-to-99-names.html

But the majority of Muslim scholars do believe that the names exceed 99. 

Personally, when I pray, the name I call depends on the attribute/quality I want to praise; that's why I stick to what is mentioned in the Quran in terms of names. I can't know why Muslim don't just stick to their holy book in those regards.

Wahhab is in the Quran, it's included about 3 times. 

"Abd" means "slaves", so "Abd Allah/Abdullah" means "the slave of Allah", "Abd Al Rahman/Abdulrahman" means "the slave of the merciful"...etc. 

Our "Abd Al Wahhab" is called Mohammed; that's his personal name, Abdul Wahhab is his dad, "Mohammed, the son of, Abd Al Wahhab".
Ibn=the son of.

These exorcism stuff just make wonder. Yep, psychological mess is translated as "demon possession", and when people don't agree with you there's always the "dark influence" charge to  throw at your enemies.

Atlas I cannot repeat this enough, while I think it is great that you are not so insecure as to fear having your claims picked on, you also are missing very glaring problems with your own logic too.

I find it absurd, when any religion does this, not just yours.

Why cant you see the problem with claiming your claimed god, by your logic, you claim loves you and humanity, but chooses to allow all the violence and drama even between fellow Muslims? I am sorry Atlas, but the Quran is still the same book Mystic is using that you are using to come to very different conclusions.

If I had two kids who were fighting over their toys to the point where they were harming each other, I would take the toys away. 

Imagine for a second, you were an employee at a bicycle factory, now imagine if that factory boss gave you an assembly manual the workers could not agree on. Imagine if those workers started murdering each other over the interpretations of how to assemble the bikes? Would you find that boss moral, or insane?

I find it absurd to claim that any god someone wants to claim, would value needless drama and violence while at the same time claiming this alleged god has the power to make it clear. 

Atlas, the truth is that those books were written by humans who didn't have any modern understanding of reality like we do now. The Quran and Jewish OT and Bible were all written in an age of tribal kingdoms and all of them competed with each other over which tribe was the correct tribe, even within the same religions fighting over the very same books. Not just other religions.

There were not written religions 200,000 years ago, much less 4 billion years ago, much less 13.8 billion years ago. I find it absurd to even claim that humans, much less any one religion, are the center of the planet, much less the universe. It makes much more sense to me that humans believe in these things because they don't like the idea of being finite.

[ReptilianPeon]

Thank you for the information. The Wikipedia page does say this:

There is no universal agreement among Muslims as to what exactly counts as a name of Allah, and what does not. Additionally, while some names are only in the Qur'an, and others are only in the hadith, there are some names which appear in both. Different sources give different lists of the 99 names

Every believer is different and I don't think any two people can have the exact same view of the Quran. The religion of the person sitting next to you is always going to be different to your own. You will always find things you disagree on. People can talk about truth when they can't even agree with their own community on what truth actually is. It's funny.
That's why Yasir Qadi got death threats from the henchmen of al-Saud. He denounced them, and plus he's not anti-Shia enough. He was interviewed by Iranian Press TV and people seem really bitter about that. He wants Sunni and Shia to get along and he gets death threats for it.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

100. Allah the Imaginary

[WinterHold]

Atlas I cannot repeat this enough, while I think it is great that you are not so insecure as to fear having your claims picked on, you also are missing very glaring problems with your own logic too.

I find it absurd, when any religion does this, not just yours.

Why cant you see the problem with claiming your claimed god, by your logic, you claim loves you and humanity, but chooses to allow all the violence and drama even between fellow Muslims? I am sorry Atlas, but the Quran is still the same book Mystic is using that you are using to come to very different conclusions.

If I had two kids who were fighting over their toys to the point where they were harming each other, I would take the toys away. 

Imagine for a second, you were an employee at a bicycle factory, now imagine if that factory boss gave you an assembly manual the workers could not agree on. Imagine if those workers started murdering each other over the interpretations of how to assemble the bikes? Would you find that boss moral, or insane?

I find it absurd to claim that any god someone wants to claim, would value needless drama and violence while at the same time claiming this alleged god has the power to make it clear. 

Atlas, the truth is that those books were written by humans who didn't have any modern understanding of reality like we do now. The Quran and Jewish OT and Bible were all written in an age of tribal kingdoms and all of them competed with each other over which tribe was the correct tribe, even within the same religions fighting over the very same books. Not just other religions.

There were not written religions 200,000 years ago, much less 4 billion years ago, much less 13.8 billion years ago. I find it absurd to even claim that humans, much less any one religion, are the center of the planet, much less the universe. It makes much more sense to me that humans believe in these things because they don't like the idea of being finite.

God doesn't love humanity in Islam. The relationship is represented as a "slave/master" kind of thing, where God is mostly feared above all.

Mystic doesn't just believe in the Quran, he believes in other books that compose his "Shia faith". He's a "Shia". He's a twelver Shiite, while faith evolves around the Quran in my religion, Mystic's faith evolves around 12 Imams that he sees as "guided ones", and tries to convince humanity to follow them.

God doesn't love us. If he does, then why does he torture us?
I find this verse in the Quran, very interesting :

Sura 5
( 18 )   But the Jews and the Christians say, "We are the children of Allah and His beloved." Say, "Then why does He punish you for your sins?" Rather, you are human beings from among those He has created. He forgives whom He wills, and He punishes whom He wills. And to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth and whatever is between them, and to Him is the [final] destination. 

Judaism and Christianity present the concept of "divine love" and chosen people (so does Mystic's Shiite faith); my faith -which is based on the Quran only- tells another story. Mystic believes in other books aside from the Quran; Brian.

I wouldn't blame the manual, if the employees decided to use manuals produced by other factories, despite the clear warning telling them not to.

Here, you can see the difference between my religion & Mystic's: I believe in the original manual only, he believes in thousand other manuals, that compose his Shiite faith. 

As for being the center of events, we aren't. We are mere "successors" on earth. It's stated very clearly in the Quran, that there are "other things" out there.

Sura 16
 ( 49 )   And to Allah prostrates whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth of creatures, and the angels [as well], and they are not arrogant.

The universe is a very big place:

Sura 40
( 57 )   The creation of the heavens and earth is greater than the creation of mankind, but most of the people do not know.

MrNoMorePropaganda

Difference in opinions about the Quran is actually one of its essence:

Sura 3
( 7 )   It is He who has sent down to you, [O Muhammad], the Book; in it are verses [that are] precise - they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those in whose hearts is deviation [from truth], they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking an interpretation [suitable to them]. And no one knows its [true] interpretation except Allah. But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All [of it] is from our Lord." And no one will be reminded except those of understanding.

You can guess the role the Hadith plays in this. So now, using this verse, we can refute Sunni/Shia claims about the "unclear" verses.
But for example, a clear verse is the verse that says God is one. Why don't the "Umma" stick to such verse instead of fighting over an unclear verse?

[SofaKingHigh]

I find the wish to be a slave the most confusing aspect of Islam.

No thank you.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

101. Allah the Slaver.

[ReptilianPeon]

Difference in opinions about the Quran is actually one of its essence:

Sura 3
( 7 )   It is He who has sent down to you, [O Muhammad], the Book; in it are verses [that are] precise - they are the foundation of the Book - and others unspecific. As for those in whose hearts is deviation [from truth], they will follow that of it which is unspecific, seeking discord and seeking an interpretation [suitable to them]. And no one knows its [true] interpretation except Allah. But those firm in knowledge say, "We believe in it. All [of it] is from our Lord." And no one will be reminded except those of understanding.

You can guess the role the Hadith plays in this. So now, using this verse, we can refute Sunni/Shia claims about the "unclear" verses.
But for example, a clear verse is the verse that says God is one. Why don't the "Umma" stick to such verse instead of fighting over an unclear verse?

"And no one knows its [true] interpretation except Allah."
That's the key. Allah realeases a complete commentary on the Quran and the conflict goes away. Not all disagreements come from the Hadith though. Desires also drive people; organizations and governments can manipulate religious texts - drive the agenda - especially if a large number of people are illiterate.

And I don't think the Ahmadiyya group (not aligned with Ibadi, Sunni nor Shia), of which there are millions around the world, justify their belief in Mirza Ghulam Ahmad solely on Hadith. Although, to be fair, the Quran doesn't have much to say about Madhi - as far as I'm aware. However, Ahmadiyya also refer to the Bible for their justifications of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad and say he is related to the second coming of Isa. They don't have their own collection of Hadith like Ibadis, Shia and Sunni do; they largely use Sunni Hadith.

[WinterHold]

I find the wish to be a slave the most confusing aspect of Islam.

No thank you.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master/slave_(technology)

In the scenario above (which you'll defiantly run through if you studied computing); master pieces of software give guidance and draw the path of work for slave processes, let's take a "Master clock" as an example, that all "slave clocks" are adjusted in respects of their master.


Well, slavery to God is similar to that. It's not the human-type of slavery of uncle Tom.

To machines,slavery is something else, to God and Islam slavery (is yet again) a different thing. It's not the disturbing human-type of slavery.

When humans enslave each other, it is wrong.
But when we adjust clocks using a "Master/Slave" approach; we aren't comitting anything wrong; instead: a wise move.

Wyrd of Gawd

He is, just like the Operating System in your computer.

MNMP

It was meant to be like this; I call them "traps", for example:
Why would a person, leave the filled half of the cup and focus on the empty one, unless he wanted to tyranically control others be unique?

Just like the Muslim, who tries to make sense out of the "letters" that come in the begining of some suras:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muqatta%CA%BFat

Actually we all know what's the catch: he want to claim superiority and false "magical" powers >< Like the magicians that fill the miiddle east, and take tons of cash to do "black magic" that makes girls get married or bound a man to a lady; these stuff..funny and ironic, but let's not forget that this cartoon-like mentality and way of thinking that is worthy of kindergarden is what brought Sunni/Shia Islam back, in the speed of light years.

Ah, the Sunni Hadiths are very disturbing to be honest, especially the part of the coming of christ.. One reason that makes Sunnies hate my guts, is my disbelief in the advent of Christ. That puts me in a problem with Shia even more, because I disbelieve in the 12th Imam (Mehdi) also. Sunnies believe in him of course,too. 

Many people thought of themselves as the "Mehdi", actually it did bring huge political advanteges to so many movements.

[Minimalist]

I think I have a lot patience in that I repeat the same things over and over again,

It's not patience.  It's redundancy.