For Americans tired of NRA bullying.

[henryp]

"Those who sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither"  Benjamin Franklin. Yea I agree, but what you forget is that he set up a government himself, and that new government wrote a Constitution that was designed to PROTECT the idea of rule of law and and political pluralism. You misuse that quote to justify "no rules".

That is a misuse of that quote to avoid the other part of "rights" which is responsibility, which isn't simply "hitting a target".

You are justifying a free for all, not even close to what Ben meant by that quote. And again, it is also defied by "well regulated" which means LAWS. That is what laws are, regulations.

Just to be clear, I think the quote is stupid.  I just find it funny that it was used so frequently by anti-patriot act people who have a lot of overlap with anti-gun.

I think reasonable laws are fine.  But I don't see a lot of reasonable laws being proposed.  

My theory, is that politically speaking, the left (in power) sees this issue as a winner, and they'd like to keep the issue in their pocket forever.  And the NRA, I think wisely politically speaking, is refusing to give an inch, because if they are fighting for something they don't really care about, then they aren't risking something the do care about.

[The Grand Nudger]

My theory, is that politically speaking, the left (in power) sees this issue as a winner, and they'd like to keep the issue in their pocket forever.  And the NRA, I think wisely politically speaking, is refusing to give an inch, because if they are fighting for something they don't really care about, then they aren't risking something the do care about.

b-mine

Bingo, the NRA are powerbrokers who use guns as a wedge, they don't give a shit about gun rights or gun violence. Now......how about the gun control lobby, what do we think their relationship to guns, gun rights or gun violence might be?

[The Grand Nudger]

You are. Again, if our current laws worked, and we both agree they are not, but if they did, we would not have the amount of gun violence we do, but we do.

How would we know....when we don't enforce them..?

The NRA got hijacked by nuts back in the 1970s and ever since they have done nothing but protect profits and expanded our flooded market, and on top of that hamstrung any and all attempts to fix anything. It is the the same theistic logic tactic of creating a needless problem, then blaming everyone else for the problem you(meaning the NRA) caused in the first place.

-and gun control is being hijacked, right now, by people like yourself.  Vultures who prey on misery and flower in the brilliant light of ignorance and mediocrity.

[RetiredArmy]

Who agrees we should do a better job of enforcing our current guns laws, and how do we accomplish that?

[The Grand Nudger]

:raises hand:

-Boot DA's who fail to prosecute for reasons of career comfort. By boot I mean drag them through the public square and soil their names for generations. Obviously, anything less isn't working.

[Gawdzilla]

Who agrees we should do a better job of enforcing our current guns laws, and how do we accomplish that?

We can start by getting "certain groups" to stop screaming "slippery slope!!!!" when a law is passed or enforced.

[henryp]

Who agrees we should do a better job of enforcing our current guns laws, and how do we accomplish that?

We can start by getting "certain groups" to stop screaming "slippery slope!!!!" when a law is passed or enforced.

Slippery slope is not a make believe idea.  It's a real strategy for changing society.  As I said earlier to Brian, if you're old enough, you remember the Gay rights movement starting by the community just asking to be viewed as an alternative lifestyle on MTv.  Now if you called homosexuality an alternative lifestyle, you'd be labeled a bigot.

You don't do anything in one fell swoop.  You baby step your way to the goal.

And rationally, again, when someone goes into a school and shoots a bunch of kids with a hunting rifle, or pistol, people aren't going to see that as the successful endpoint of the gun control issue.  "Finally, kids are being murdered inefficiently with guns!  Job well done!" is not going to be the reaction.

[RetiredArmy]

Who agrees we should do a better job of enforcing our current guns laws, and how do we accomplish that?

We can start by getting "certain groups" to stop screaming "slippery slope!!!!" when a law is passed or enforced.

Nice non-answer

[Gawdzilla]

We can start by getting "certain groups" to stop screaming "slippery slope!!!!" when a law is passed or enforced.

Slippery slope is not a make believe idea.  It's a real strategy for changing society.  As I said earlier to Brian, if you're old enough, you remember the Gay rights movement starting by the community just asking to be viewed as an alternative lifestyle on MTv.  Now if you called homosexuality an alternative lifestyle, you'd be labeled a bigot.

You don't do anything in one fell swoop.  You baby step your way to the goal.

And rationally, again, when someone goes into a school and shoots a bunch of kids with a hunting rifle, or pistol, people aren't going to see that as the successful endpoint of the gun control issue.  "Finally, kids are being murdered inefficiently with guns!  Job well done!" is not going to be the reaction.

See?

[Gawdzilla]

We can start by getting "certain groups" to stop screaming "slippery slope!!!!" when a law is passed or enforced.

Nice non-answer

You were refuted in the next prior post.