Is white privilege real? To what extent?

[paulpablo]

I was looking at another thread where I sensed an argument about white privilege is about to begin and since I already argued about this term for several pages with several different people in another thread I thought the topic might deserve it's own thread everyone who has an opinion about it doesn't have to keep regurgitating the same points in several different threads.

First of all let me clarify the definition of privilege.  

 an advantage that only one person or group of people has, usually because of their position or because they are rich

The main problem I encountered last time several people on this forum had a discussion about white privilege is that people were sometimes bring up circumstances saying these things don't happen to white people, when they do.  Or they were saying white people have it better in this situation than black people have, but then forgetting that other racial groups have it better than white people in that same situation. 

I would say that's an important point to make, that if other racial groups have it better than white people in this specific thing that's supposed to be a white privilege, it can't be a white privilege.


My opinion on it is that it's probably real in certain circumstances but it's not as prevalent as a lot of people make it out to be.

I think it's real in a very fluid and conditional way.  

If you're white and you outnumber non whites and ontop of that the whites around you aren't liberal left wing people and they have an ingroup preference you'd probably have an advantage.

Obviously this isn't a strong solid set of circumstances, I for example, live in England, a white majority country.  My specific area is majority white but with a very large pakistani community who have a very strong in group preference.

For example there was a car accident in my area involving a Romanian crashing into a Pakistani car, around 5 Romanians came to help the Romanian who had been pulled out of his car, and then around 30 or more Pakistanis came to control the situation.

In a dispute over a car accident or something like that in my area, I wouldn't feel privileged when I'm around another racial group that can call on that kind of tight nit support so fast. I can call the police, but I live in this community and they all know where I live, I'd be at a heavy disadvantage in any dispute of this kind.  

So you COULD call that a privilege, but then that's the privilege all other racial groups get when they outnumber other racial groups.  

I could understand white privileged being used as a comment about how white people have it easier in some circumstances, in the courts for example, where females also have a lot of female privilege.

My opinion is basically the opposite of how buzzfeed views white privilege. 

https://www.buzzfeed.com/michaelblackmon....xuzAdQZDA


If anyone can be bothered to click the link and view the list of examples of white privilege these are my short and sweet rebuttals to the list. 

1) Not true. Without a doubt.
2) Not true. Without a doubt.
3) Possibly true if you don't live in certain countries.
4) Not true. Without a doubt.
5) Debatable.
6) Not true. Without a doubt.
7) Don't even know what this one is trying to imply, probably not true in certain circumstances aswell.
8) Not true. Without a doubt.
9) Not true. Without a doubt.
10) The premise is based on you having lighter skin than other people so technically true I suppose.
11) Absolutely not true.
12) Not true.
13) Don't know what this means.
14) Without a doubt not true.
15) Debatable.
16) Not even worth responding to.
17) HAHAHAHAHAA. Laughable. 

If anyone wants me to go into those rebuttals in more serious detail I'm willing to if anyone thinks they are worth taking seriously. 

This is my main problem with the way some people come up with examples of White privilege.

It's basically, think of something bad that happened to a black person, claim it doesn't happen to white people even if it does, who cares? That's the white privilege.

Anyway to conclude, I think white privilege can be real in specific circumstances, just not to the extent most people view it as being so prevalent, world wide, and without exceptions.

Also if you're going to start adding the word privilege to adjectives there's a long long list of them.

Female, male, tall, short, attractive, clever, rich.

[Seraphina]

Maybe white privilege is real. To what extent though? Who knows?
It's a reductive way of viewing society.

There are no biological races - race is a social construct.
What about someone who considers themselves Latino or black but they pass as white. Do they have white privilege?
Do people who are known as (the highly derogatory term) white trash enjoy white privilege too?

Wealth and class are far bigger issues and confer way more privilege but the powers that be want us to fight each other on race issues to distract us and keep us from picking up our torches and pitchforks and getting rid of our elite overlords.

[Homeless Nutter]

[...]
Also if you're going to start adding the word privilege to adjectives there's a long long list of them.

Female, male, tall, short, attractive, clever, rich.

Lol... What? Name one way in which short people are privileged? One.

Sure - tall, attractive, intelligent and rich people ARE privileged and do receive special treatment in our society, even if they themselves did nothing to gain them, because those attributes appeal to our base instincts. It sucks and if - for example - bosses are caught discriminating against sexually unattractive employees (when the job itself doesn't require good looks) - they  should be held accountable. What of it?

[SteelCurtain]

I'm sorry, but the irony in your conclusions about white privilege is palpable.

I cannot speak for England, but in America, as a black person, you have no clue what you're talking about. While I object to Buzzfeed's use of the word 'never' in most of those memes, a lot of their examples are spot on.

By and large, white people do not have to deal with a lot of the systemic injustices that are a part of everyday life for people of color. Some of the things you said were "Not True. Without a doubt" are absolutely credible examples of white privilege.

The fact that regularly people act surprised at how well spoken I am, or that white people dressed with the exact same clothing (hoodies, baggy jeans, certain natural hairstyles) will be labelled stylish when a black person would be labelled a thug, the worry (not the prospect that it will never happen, but the consistent, constant concern) that any contact with police could be your last or could end up in imprisonment or violence, or that if you wear your hair the way it naturally grows out you might not get a job or might be pigeonholed into a cultural meme are all examples of white privilege.

None of these things never happen to white people. It's not that only black people have to deal with these things. It's that what you don't or won't recognize is that these little things are part of everyday life for black people and other people of color. Every day. There are other factors at play, sure. There's economic/class privilege that plays a lot into it.

The most telling aspect is that black people are saying, "hey--pay attention, you guys by and large don't have to deal with this crap all the time." And a lot of white people are seriously just dismissing this out of hand, like "no you don't" or "it's not that bad, get over it." This is the most invasive type of privilege.

[BrokenQuill92]

I'm sorry, but the irony in your conclusions about white privilege is palpable.

I cannot speak for England, but in America, as a black person, you have no clue what you're talking about. While I object to Buzzfeed's use of the word 'never' in most of those memes, a lot of their examples are spot on.

By and large, white people do not have to deal with a lot of the systemic injustices that are a part of everyday life for people of color. Some of the things you said were "Not True. Without a doubt" are absolutely credible examples of white privilege.

The fact that regularly people act surprised at how well spoken I am, or that white people dressed with the exact same clothing (hoodies, baggy jeans, certain natural hairstyles) will be labelled stylish when a black person would be labelled a thug, the worry (not the prospect that it will never happen, but the consistent, constant concern) that any contact with police could be your last or could end up in imprisonment or violence, or that if you wear your hair the way it naturally grows out you might not get a job or might be pigeonholed into a cultural meme are all examples of white privilege.

None of these things never happen to white people. It's not that only black people have to deal with these things. It's that what you don't or won't recognize is that these little things are part of everyday life for black people and other people of color. Every day. There are other factors at play, sure. There's economic/class privilege that plays a lot into it.

The most telling aspect is that black people are saying, "hey--pay attention, you guys by and large don't have to deal with this crap all the time." And a lot of white people are seriously just dismissing this out of hand, like "no you don't" or "it's not that bad, get over it." This is the most invasive type of privilege.

This^^^ all of this. Not to mention you must maintain strict emotional control, and sometimes subject yourself to white peoples rude and invasive attitudes or be labeled "angry".

[BrokenQuill92]

[...]
Also if you're going to start adding the word privilege to adjectives there's a long long list of them.

Female, male, tall, short, attractive, clever, rich.

Lol... What? Name one way in which short people are privileged? One.

Sure - tall, attractive, intelligent and rich people ARE privileged and do receive special treatment in our society, even if they themselves did nothing to gain them, because those attributes appeal to our base instincts. It sucks and if - for example - bosses are caught discriminating against sexually unattractive employees (when the job itself doesn't require good looks) - they  should be held accountable. What of it?

Short women are VERY privileged. My gender is never questioned. I'm always considered plenty feminine. No has ever felt uncomfortable with me wearing heels. No has ever turned me down for a date because "it would look weird". And clothes for tall women are a real struggle. As are stylish shoes.

[The Valkyrie]

I'm trying to make Beccs Privilege a thing.

Does that count?

[Homeless Nutter]

Short women are VERY privileged. My gender is never questioned. I'm always considered plenty feminine. No has ever felt uncomfortable with me wearing heels. No has ever turned me down for a date because "it would look weird". And clothes for tall women are a real struggle. As are stylish shoes.

I suppose. But is it the short women, that are better off, or the ones of about average height? Because quite frankly - I imagine women, who are much below average are not considered particularly attractive, even if they don't have it as bad as "short-ass" men, or "freakishly" tall women.

[account_inactive]

Not in the UK. But I can't speak for the US.

[BrokenQuill92]

Short women are VERY privileged. My gender is never questioned. I'm always considered plenty feminine. No has ever felt uncomfortable with me wearing heels. No has ever turned me down for a date because "it would look weird". And clothes for tall women are a real struggle. As are stylish shoes.

I suppose. But is it the short women, that are better off, or the ones of about average height? Because quite frankly - I imagine women, who are much below average are not considered particularly attractive, even if they don't have it as bad as "short-ass" men, or "freakishly" tall women.

Actually as long as you're proportionate and have some curves to speak of the men or/and women will line up. It's usually only flat AND short women that are down on their luck. And I'm far from flat.