Personal experience

[Captain Scarlet]

Does it matter? My personal experiences have been that there was nothing there, I directly apprehended the non existence of a god. That has stayed with me but I have never advanced it as an argument in favour of my athiesm because i am prone to delusion like anyone is. There are many better arguments in favour of atheism so why would I rely on this. But theists seem to advance this as evidence of a god/s from any religion. Is this because all other evidence is either non existence or terrible and there is nothing left to fall back on? Or is it viewed as partic relevant in a religious context. If so why are my experinces any less worthy?

[theVOID]

I can only speak for myself, but my rejection of God claims has to do entirely with my wanting to be consistent and rational in my beliefs.I reject all claims that have no logical necessity or evidence in indication. It's not an argument directly for disbelief rather it's an argument against the validity of the claims being made.

Personal experience is useless, it leads to a potentially unlimited number of contradictory conclusions. If a standard or methodology for arriving at your answer can lead to contradictory conclusions when applied in the same way by other people (such as my personal experience said x=1 yours said x=2) it is not sound, therefore i do not accept it as sufficient.

[DiRNiS]

Theists usually refer to "personal experience" as a reason they believe in a god. This is because there is no way to prove with solid and quantifiable evidence that their deity exists. They will often say, God has talked to me, or I can feel him, etc as a weak argument for their beliefs, but they are just a product of their imagination and delusion. I too used to be a believer (though not a fervently strong one) and even attributed good things that happened in my life to an imaginary being. That is until I realised that good and bad things happen to everyone regardless of their religious beliefs.

Everyone has different types of experiences, some will attribute good or bad experiences to some form of divine intervention, some won't. It largely depends on what you believe in. If you were indoctrinated with religious faith, you will most likely attribute events in your life and personal experiences as coming from a divine source. Those who can think rationally won't.

[Ace Otana]

Like, VOID. I too must speak for myself.
I rejected the whole religious thing mainly on lack of convincing evidence. Many things have played a role in my continuence atheistic state. I was an atheist long before I knew of the word 'atheist'. Religion just seemed too simplistic and unrealistic. It seemed like some corrupt company trying to sell you it's shoddy goods. Only religion was trying to sell me it's shoddy lies like "afterlife". It just seemed odd and convenient that you cannot possibly know it's a pack of lies until you are long dead. Where you cannot tell anyone who still lives of that lie. Theres no way anyone can test such a claim. Very convenient...too convenient.

So I never bought it.
Religion makes claims that cannot possibly be tested and so I reserve judgement til there is some evidence to point one way or the other. Religion and it's claims remain rejected/dismissed as nothing more than baseless assertions. Just a belief.

Personal experiance means nothing to me.

[solja247]

Does it matter? My personal experiences have been that there was nothing there, I directly apprehended the non existence of a god. That has stayed with me but I have never advanced it as an argument in favour of my athiesm because i am prone to delusion like anyone is. There are many better arguments in favour of atheism so why would I rely on this. But theists seem to advance this as evidence of a god/s from any religion. Is this because all other evidence is either non existence or terrible and there is nothing left to fall back on? Or is it viewed as partic relevant in a religious context. If so why are my experinces any less worthy?

We are both emotional and logical beings.

I have only had one special revelation from God.

I was at a Christian camp (I was 15) and I was utterly depressed. I was at the beach and lying and some rocks. For some reason I said, 'God if your there send some dolphins.' Of course, I doubted there was going to be any. A few minuets later, I saw dolphins not too far away from me. I Have been to that place 12 yrs in a row and never seen dolpins there.

When I was doubting my faith and was agnostic, I was never able to dismiss this as being coincidence.
Experiences shape what you believe. That could be a fear in spiders of heights, or a belief in God or a disbelief. Experinces should be seen as subjective evidence.

[Eilonnwy]

Man, see every time I wish the red light would turn green it eventually happens. Are you saying that's god?

I don't doubt that this experience was real to you, but it could easily be a coincidence. And Occam's razor says we shave away any unnecessary explanations. So which is more likely...you asked for Dolphins and luckily there happened to be some around? Or a supernatural being that supposedly created life and can hear millions of prayers decided to answer your prayer, despite the single mom praying for food for her children, or the millions of people dying from all sorts of diseases and praying for a miracle, he decided yours was the one he would answer, and so he magically sent dolphins to your beach to cheer you up. (Holy run on sentence, batman!)

I'll go with the former.

[DiRNiS]

I was at a Christian camp (I was 15) and I was utterly depressed. I was at the beach and lying and some rocks. For some reason I said, 'God if your there send some dolphins.' Of course, I doubted there was going to be any. A few minuets later, I saw dolphins not too far away from me. I Have been to that place 12 yrs in a row and never seen dolpins there.

Tell that to a mother that fervently prays to god to not let her child die from cancer and her child dies anyway. This is one of the problems I find with theistic beliefs. Why would god find it more important to send dolphins to entertain you or help someone do well in his/her driving test but let millions of children starve to death or mothers lose their children to disease after begging the same god not to let it happen?

It is not that I don't believe your claim that you saw dolphins, but I don't see it is a proof of your god's existence. If you ask me, yes, I say it is coincidence. There is no imaginary being up there granting wishes to random people. An all benevolent god would have much higher priorities such as healing a sick kid or helping a mother find food for her starving children rather than making some dolphins come near you.

---

Dammit Eilonnwy, you beat me to it.

But yeah, my thoughts exactly.

[annatar]

We are both emotional and logical beings.

I have only had one special revelation from God.

I was at a Christian camp (I was 15) and I was utterly depressed. I was at the beach and lying and some rocks. For some reason I said, 'God if your there send some dolphins.' Of course, I doubted there was going to be any. A few minuets later, I saw dolphins not too far away from me. I Have been to that place 12 yrs in a row and never seen dolpins there.

So you saw some dolphins in the sea and took it as revelation? and of course everybody knows that there are no dolphins in the sea. if you had asked for a mermaid and seen one that would be something.. but you saw dolphins! and in the sea! not in a shopping mall or starbucks.

[tackattack]

anyone with a materialistic perspective on reality will deny any kind of subjective evidence as having any value. Those who accept the possibility of the intangible as a more than likely possibility use all evidence, especially using like evidence for valid proofs.

[chasm]

anyone with a materialistic perspective on reality will deny any kind of subjective evidence as having any value.

You mean those of us with a rational mind that use our five senses to make sense of the word around us, and therefore base our assumptions and beliefs on things that can be proven by our five senses, instead of believing in magic and fairy tales?