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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 5:02 pm
(This post was last modified: September 24, 2016 at 5:18 pm by InquiringMind.)
(September 24, 2016 at 3:51 pm)Excited Penguin Wrote: InquiringMind, please, please don't let anyone here change you. And stick around. Some of us, well, I, appreciate you.
Thanks. I appreciate your comments
(September 24, 2016 at 4:03 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: I know you're not a fan of evolutionary psychology, so I'll just present this as my own pet theory for you to speculate on.
I believe some of the first-order approximations of evolutionary psychology, i.e. we are afraid of some things because they are dangerous. But when people start getting into explanations about why blue eyes are usually considered more attractive than brown eyes, or why "parental investment theory" explains why people choose certain partners over others and explains people's motivation for cheating on their partner, I just don't think there's enough evidence to support the claims that are being made. I believe such claims at about a 30% confidence level, which to me isn't enough to be publishable as good science.
So if you're talking about the "mild dissatisfaction" theory, where people who were never fully satisfied with their lives were more likely to survive and reproduce, I don't know if that's any better of an explanation for why people seek meaning than the explanation that corporations want us to be dissatisfied with our lives so they can sell us more stuff.
The explanation of conservation/exploration does seem to help explain a little, but whether or not that's how we actually evolved is hard to say, because we don't have the hard data. It might give me a little bit of direction in what to do, though. If I'm feeling dissatisfied (which I am) then it might be time for a little exploration, and it might be time to try some things that I've never tried before. The life I have now is the result of everything I have done, thought, and felt in the past. So if I want something different, I have to do something different.
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 5:41 pm
(September 24, 2016 at 3:07 pm)InquiringMind Wrote: (September 24, 2016 at 2:59 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: I was speaking more to the way you slather "meaning" willy-nilly in your OP to things that don't necessarily have, or need, meaning.
It seems to me to be a form of equivocation.
Life can be meaningful without applying that standard to every tiny facet of it, I think.
I was trying to explore whether or not meaning was ultimately what I'm looking for. I was seeing whether having the maximum possible meaning in my life is what I really want.
Yeah, I just think you're running afoul Maslow's Hammer in the OP.
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 5:58 pm
Perhaps a better approach would not be subjective personal meaning but high levels of harmonious function with environment.
I've walked around properties and trimmed dead/suckers off trees that were not part of the job...because I enjoy taking care of trees. The meaning for me was just based line maintenance, what should be done regardless. But it was much more meaningful to the client.
A bicycle is not very meaningful as a functional bicycle if it has a broken chain and 2 flat tires....unless it a decorative lawn ornament in your yard of your child's first bike they'e long outgrown.
"Leave it to me to find a way to be,
Consider me a satellite forever orbiting,
I knew the rules but the rules did not know me, guaranteed." - Eddie Vedder
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 6:17 pm
(This post was last modified: September 24, 2016 at 6:18 pm by InquiringMind.)
(September 24, 2016 at 5:58 pm)Arkilogue Wrote: Perhaps a better approach would not be subjective personal meaning but high levels of harmonious function with environment.
Now this is a good idea. Back before the DSM-III threw the term out, psychologists spoke of "neurosis," and most any life problem a patient had could be classified as in some way neurotic. I've read that neurosis is, at its core, "the failure of the individual to adapt to their environment." For example, a failure for me on this front would be to attempt to maintain the social and relationship habits of Mormonism, even though the people around me aren't Mormon. Or, at a deeper level, to maintain the behaviors that worked for my in childhood, but that are no longer adaptive in my current environment.
So if my goal is to live, not to find meaning, then part of that goal is to become better adapted to my environment.
I like that
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 6:17 pm
@OP Q
Life doesn't come with a manual. No one possesses what you're requesting.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 7:13 pm
(September 24, 2016 at 6:17 pm)InquiringMind Wrote: (September 24, 2016 at 5:58 pm)Arkilogue Wrote: Perhaps a better approach would not be subjective personal meaning but high levels of harmonious function with environment.
Now this is a good idea. Back before the DSM-III threw the term out, psychologists spoke of "neurosis," and most any life problem a patient had could be classified as in some way neurotic. I've read that neurosis is, at its core, "the failure of the individual to adapt to their environment." For example, a failure for me on this front would be to attempt to maintain the social and relationship habits of Mormonism, even though the people around me aren't Mormon. Or, at a deeper level, to maintain the behaviors that worked for my in childhood, but that are no longer adaptive in my current environment.
So if my goal is to live, not to find meaning, then part of that goal is to become better adapted to my environment.
I like that Happy to be of navigational service! I work on the personal map when I need to, but I also get out there and check my position with a compass and the stars.
Harmonious interaction on multiple levels with your environment is a feedback loop of energy, like the grab of a water wheel....the water is flowing all the time, you just have to dip into it and all it to push you while in place.
This also increases stored/available energy like a hydro-electric generator. It can be as simple as gardening by oneself or working with teams on complex world problems.
There is an inertia of meaning already going on, tap it and surf the waves!
"Leave it to me to find a way to be,
Consider me a satellite forever orbiting,
I knew the rules but the rules did not know me, guaranteed." - Eddie Vedder
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 7:18 pm
(September 24, 2016 at 6:17 pm)Rhythm Wrote: @OP Q
Life doesn't come with a manual. No one possesses what you're requesting.
Life comes with many manuals, more than you could ever hope to read in a life time. Most people accept the manual their parents/culture give them. Some seek manuals from outside there cultures and then there are past manuals to consider.
There's also much merit in making your own manual, sticking to it and revising it as you gain more skillful means.
And then the is the manual of Nature herself. Open to all, hidden in plain site and revealed only to those who take the time to respect and get to know her.
"Leave it to me to find a way to be,
Consider me a satellite forever orbiting,
I knew the rules but the rules did not know me, guaranteed." - Eddie Vedder
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 7:21 pm
(This post was last modified: September 24, 2016 at 7:22 pm by InquiringMind.)
(September 24, 2016 at 7:13 pm)Arkilog Wrote: Harmonious interaction on multiple levels with your environment is a feedback loop of energy, like the grab of a water wheel....the water is flowing all the time, you just have to dip into it and all it to push you while in place.
This also increases stored/available energy like a hydro-electric generator. It can be as simple as gardening by oneself or working with teams on complex world problems.
I don't think I understood any of this.
(September 24, 2016 at 7:13 pm)Arkilogue Wrote: There is an inertia of meaning already going on, tap it and surf the waves!
This part I understood, both literally and figuratively.
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 7:36 pm
(This post was last modified: September 24, 2016 at 7:36 pm by Arkilogue.)
(September 24, 2016 at 7:21 pm)InquiringMind Wrote: (September 24, 2016 at 7:13 pm)Arkilog Wrote: Harmonious interaction on multiple levels with your environment is a feedback loop of energy, like the grab of a water wheel....the water is flowing all the time, you just have to dip into it and all it to push you while in place.
This also increases stored/available energy like a hydro-electric generator. It can be as simple as gardening by oneself or working with teams on complex world problems.
I don't think I understood any of this.
The same mechanics are at work when you go on a hike and feel good about being in the woods but this is at a subjective/subconscious level. You are in the midst of dense life which is radiating magnetic and photonic information from every living cell. (DNA radiation, aka biophoton). In the garden setting you are directly, consciously involved in the care of these living plant beings that will then nuture you in the future so there is greater "grab" on your environment on an interactive level.
Bumping this way up the interactive layer cake would be working with like minded individuals with diverse skill sets all working together as a mental organic being to tackle larger scope problems in the greater garden of mankind. The flow of intentional inertia that level taps into is thrust of human civilization itself from past to present and pointing into the future. It has trajectory already, and only humans (barring theoretical alien meddling) influence can change it's course.
"Leave it to me to find a way to be,
Consider me a satellite forever orbiting,
I knew the rules but the rules did not know me, guaranteed." - Eddie Vedder
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RE: Let's Say I Achieve "Meaning." What Do I Do Next?
September 24, 2016 at 7:41 pm
I really can't stress the importance of growing ones own food...this taps deep fundamental roots in our DNA, bio-electric machine and gut biome.
We are an internally symbiotic organism already with trillions of bacteria "calling" us the universe. So the goal on this planet would be to be good bacteria that does not parasitize the host, destroy the body, and call down an inflammatory immune response from her body. And unfortunately humanity has lost touch with it's living role in a living system and dies because of it.
"Leave it to me to find a way to be,
Consider me a satellite forever orbiting,
I knew the rules but the rules did not know me, guaranteed." - Eddie Vedder
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