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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 12, 2016 at 10:27 am
-like 99% of the things human beings do.
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 12, 2016 at 11:14 am
I think it is an inherently immoral act, but would never judge the character of someone who did it. Mental illness is real and almost always the cause of suicide. While I think suicide is immoral, I feel nothing but sorry for those who took their own life.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 12, 2016 at 8:11 pm
(This post was last modified: December 12, 2016 at 8:13 pm by henryp.)
I've never understood how suicide isn't viewed under the "My body, my choice" umbrella.
The only way I could see it being viewed as immoral (outside of religion) is if you have young'ish kids. Their existence is your doing, so an amount of obligation to not fuck them up by offing yourself seems reasonable.
Outside that, I'm fairly pro suicide. I think suicide prevention should be about making sure the person wants to do it, and making sure they've explored alternatives. Not trying to talk them out of it. Perhaps an age limit might be appropriate though.
I say that, because a lot of young people seem to do it, and the decision is pretty ill informed. The braces come off, the acne clears up, you lose the baby fat, you find some another uggo/weirdo who likes you, you get rich, college life is differnet, post college life is different, a drug fixes some brain imbalance, etc... Lots and lots of things have the potential to go right when you're young that can end with 60 good years. I always thought it odd, when a fat kid kills themselves over bullying. Seems like they'd give 'get shredded and show these assholes' a try. But I guess that goes to show how hard it is to get to the gym.
Back on point, if you've legitimately have a good idea what life has in store, and it's kind of shit, and you'd rather not...It seems like a valid choice.
Which brings me to why I don't like the general tact people take, which is to be selfish and try to guilt someone into staying alive. "Oh, I'll miss you." "Oh, you'll hurt people who love you!" Always struck me as awful for people to make you staying alive about them, and heap some guilt on the person to try and keep them from doing it. Your life is your own to live or not live as you see fit.
I predict in the future, my attitude will be much closer to the norm.
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 12, 2016 at 8:16 pm
Suicide is determined by culture. Morality is not.
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 13, 2016 at 3:51 pm
(December 12, 2016 at 8:16 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Suicide is determined by culture. Morality is not.
Except. . . it totally is.
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 13, 2016 at 3:57 pm
(December 12, 2016 at 8:16 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Suicide is determined by culture. Morality is not.
I thought most atheists thought morality IS determined by culture?
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 13, 2016 at 4:21 pm
(December 13, 2016 at 3:57 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: (December 12, 2016 at 8:16 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Suicide is determined by culture. Morality is not.
I thought most atheists thought morality IS determined by culture?
Well, we aren't exactly a hive-mind. This forum should be proof enough of that.
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 13, 2016 at 4:21 pm
Individual cultures have widely different stances on the issue. Perhaps you would be happier with "some cultures approve while others do not." But then there are sub-sects because in Islam for example which sees suicide as a great sin.... most of the time. At other times, it's a ticket to heaven.
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 13, 2016 at 4:25 pm
(December 13, 2016 at 4:21 pm)Jesster Wrote: (December 13, 2016 at 3:57 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: I thought most atheists thought morality IS determined by culture?
Well, we aren't exactly a hive-mind. This forum should be proof enough of that.
Oh I know. I said I thought most did, though I would never say all.
"Of course, everyone will claim they respect someone who tries to speak the truth, but in reality, this is a rare quality. Most respect those who speak truths they agree with, and their respect for the speaking only extends as far as their realm of personal agreement. It is less common, almost to the point of becoming a saintly virtue, that someone truly respects and loves the truth seeker, even when their conclusions differ wildly."
-walsh
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RE: SUICIDE AND MORALITY
December 13, 2016 at 4:31 pm
It really depends who you'd be leaving behind. I am not for suicides but, at some point I think some people just can't be fixed and have gone off the deep end. It's sad.
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