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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 10:52 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2017 at 11:02 am by The Grand Nudger.)
There -is- a set definition, FandF..it's just that some people™ don't like to acknowledge that said definition explicitly refers to what never happened™.
It's not meaningless, it's just inconvenient to comfortable bigots and their apologists.
They wish to describe the theft of a culture by another culture openly hostile to the possessors of the items stolen...as an "exchange". You know, we handed them some beads, they gave us their religion. That sort of thing. Move along, nothing racist to see here. We ended up with all this land and that italian guy playing a crying indian from not-india because we were polite traders making exchanges. Hell, it was as innocent as learning a new language. We'd had some practice with it in the old country, not-stealing the holy places of one culture, or the holy icons of many, and not-twisting them to serve our own purpose, often enough not-against the very people from whom we didn't-rip them.
Never....Happened™
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:09 am
I "culturally appropriated" all sorts of stuff when I moved to New Mexico. If I didn't, I still wouldn't be fitting in with the locals. I'm not in Oregon anymore and I stopped acting like it years ago.
I don't believe you. Get over it.
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:10 am
(June 7, 2017 at 10:52 am)Khemikal Wrote: There -is- a set definition, FandF..it's just that some people™ don't like to acknowledge that said definition explicitly refers to what never happened™.
It's not meaningless, it's just inconvenient to comfortable bigots and their apologists.
They wish to describe the theft of a culture by another culture openly hostile to the possessors of the items stolen...as an "exchange". You know, we handed them some beads, they gave us their religion. That sort of thing. Move along, nothing racist to see here. We ended up with all this land and that italian guy playing a crying indian from not-india because we were polite traders making exchanges. Hell, it was as innocent as learning a new language. We'd had some practice with it in the old country, not-stealing the holy places of one culture, or the holy icons of many, and not-twisting them to serve our own purpose, often enough not-against the very people from whom we didn't-rip them.
Never....Happened™ I just looked over your previous posts, and I think I understand the description you gave. So cultural appropriation is what happens when one culture/society claims a part of another culture/society as its own while erasing/minimizing the origins of that part?
In every country and every age, the priest had been hostile to Liberty.
- Thomas Jefferson
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:45 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2017 at 11:51 am by The Grand Nudger.)
No, that can be cultural exchange. Cultural appropriation refers to a much more colonial relationship. 
So, for example. Let's say I use more spanish in my vocabulary. But, being the giant neck I am..I intentionally speak spanish with a redneck accent. I'm claiming spanish..and the manner in which I do it minimizes it's origin...but that's just a quirky method of cultural exchange.
If, however, I run a business in 1950 that takes subhuman negro music and gets a white singer to schlepp it...I've committed cultural appropriation.
If, however, I live in and support the actions of a state that depends upon some specific culture..say...spanish culture, and has benefited culturally from that culture....but simultaneously seeks to evict and erase that culture, demonizing them in the public square with the routine of a mechanical clock..... I've committed cultural appropriation.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:49 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2017 at 12:18 pm by Neo-Scholastic.)
(June 7, 2017 at 10:46 am)Khemikal Wrote: It's a form of cultural apathy when a person is in ignorance...but it's a form of broad antipathy when a person pretends to be in ignorance...as you are doing now. Not only has this shitty thing been done...people who very clearly represent the mindset that did it tell you it never happened..and that further, you're an asshole for bringing it up.
Meh...I can differentiate between the economic and political motivations of colonialism from cultural cross-pollination. I don't see the need to shut down the taco stand of white women in Portland because they got their recipes from Mexico (here). If it is morally right to demand they stop, then, by that same logic, it is morally unacceptable for Europeans to make chocolate. These kill-joy puritans are not making the world a better place; they are making it poorer and less vibrant.
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:50 am
(June 7, 2017 at 11:45 am)Khemikal Wrote: No, that can be cultural exchange. Cultural appropriation refers to a much more colonial relationship.
So, for example. Let's say I use more spanish in my vocabulary. But, being the giant neck I am..I intentionally speak spanish with a redneck accent. I'm claiming spanish..and the manner in which I do it minimizes it's origin...but that's just a quirky method of cultural exchange.
If, however, I run a business in 1950 that takes subhuman negro music and gets a white singer to schlepp it...I've committed cultural appropriation.
Does motivation have some part in it? Because in 1950 I can see someone doing that due to plain ole racism, but if today a business used music that is a cover of a cover of a cover of an old traditionally black song and the current song is done by white people..is that bad?
In every country and every age, the priest had been hostile to Liberty.
- Thomas Jefferson
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:51 am
(June 7, 2017 at 11:45 am)Khemikal Wrote: ...subhuman negro music...
What the fuck does that mean?
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 11:52 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2017 at 11:59 am by The Grand Nudger.)
You wouldn't have had to ask in 1950. You don't have to ask now either, but...you do anyway.
(June 7, 2017 at 11:50 am)FatAndFaithless Wrote: Does motivation have some part in it? Because in 1950 I can see someone doing that due to plain ole racism, but if today a business used music that is a cover of a cover of a cover of an old traditionally black song and the current song is done by white people..is that bad?
The profit motive doesn't exactly rescue the situation from a claim that a person or business has violated cultural IP.
Today, all people involved in those covers have a cut of it's use. Or, at least, that's the system in place. People get cut out, or what they have is little to nothing. A person who feels that someone has taken advantage of their IP has legal recourse. There was no such recourse for african or native americans....and there never will be. No acres, no mules...and Elvis will always be The King. Hang a dreamcatcher on either side a that and you've got the standard redneck mantle display (tastefully throw in some stars and bars as you see fit).
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 12:14 pm
BTW, if some hunky straight guy want's some "cultural appropriation" from me up his butt, I'm more than willing to help out with that.
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RE: "Cultural Appropriation"
June 7, 2017 at 12:15 pm
The "Keep Christ in Christmas" folks were charging cultural appropriation before the term was even around, but they don't get much respect around here.
Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. If meaning is being lost when outsiders do the imitation, that doesn't mean the originating group has to forget the meaning. I can keep Christ in my Christmas despite the commercialization of it.
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