a new atheist and marriage

[Brian37]

Of course there can be socially conservative atheists. Just like there can be economically conservative atheists. 

But if you are going to talk about it I can point out in a few words why both are just as bad as any theist bullshit.

1. My life is none of your fucking business as far as social issues.

2. If "fuck you I got mine" worked on economics Somalia would be a world power.

Why would you want to believe old bullshit and simply adapt it because someone sold it to you?

If you cant handle a female wearing what they want, or making more than you, or even supporting you financially what do you want me to say? You are just as bad as any right wing theist.

If you think that by a liberal theist or liberal atheist on ECONOMICS is claiming we want a nanny state like Stalin or Cuba what do you want me to say to that? I cant tell you flat out it would not be, "You got us". No my response would be "FUCK YOU".

I could give as shit less who pays the bills or who wears what, as long as it works and the parties involved consent. No, I do not think that the rich deserve to dictate economic policy but no, that does not make me anti private sector. 

Yes I have seen both socially conservative and economically conservative atheists in my past, and unfortunately they do exist. But if you think I am here to coddle your insecurities, you are barking up the wrong tree.

If you want to talk about feminism.. isn't feminism about letting women have a choice?

I think women should have a choice no matter what that choice is

(Assuming you're a female) you should be able to wear what you want and get a job if you want.. if that's okay for you to do.. why is it not okay for me to stay home and clean and cook meals for my boyfriend?

I think by coming off very angry and defensive you are really just putting people off the message you are trying to bring about. 

Labels are not very useful and just separates us as human beings

I don't consider myself leftist or right winged or anything like that. 

I'm just a person. I am a college student trying to get through school and do something great in life

I merely just wanted to know if other people had my experience and you commented with a very rude defensive post. I think that shows a lot about you. I feel you also may have your own insecurities. Most people who are angry or react in an angry manner tend to be insecure or scared and might use anger to justify something (esp something they feel important)

What I may assumed happened is my post made you uncomfortable and get angry because you hold your values to a high standard. I assume traditional relationships aren't for you and you don't feel like it is good to have that kind of lifestyle (perhaps esp for a female). I understand that. I would appreciate a civil dialogue though and perhaps you can tell me why such a life is not appropriate.

First off I am not "uncomfortable".

You came in here and asked everyone here if there were atheist  like you.

I agreed, but got sidetracked when I said their mentality was no better than a theists.

Sure, there ARE both gender role atheists and economic atheists whom lean right on par with theists. But if you expected me to agree with that merely because we both share "off"" on god claims, you set yourself up for your own disappointment. 

My "values" and "high standard"........?


Holy crap thank you for responding to my objections with more loaded cliches.

It isn't a matter of "standards" it is a matter of consent. If you have consent it does not matter who does what or what class you are in or who leads or follows or that you are equal partners. CONSENT.

We can take this even outside dating an marriage. If you are going to ask me if I want to spend time with an asshole like Trump who think's he is hot shit, vs say my late mother, or my best friend John, I could give a shit less what Trump wants or thinks. I owe him nothing. 

My X wife lead me for the time we were together, and had two degrees by the time she ended her college career. We didn't break up because I had a dick and she had a vagina. And we didn't break up because I couldn't accept her leadership in the relationship. We broke up for the mundane reason because we were not on the same page, and that had nothing to do with gender.


I am sorry but if you base a relationship based on plumbing "roles" and not communication then you are doomed to have an unhealthy relationship, because it becomes about power and control and not about cooperation and problem solving.

[brewer]

Welcome to the forum.

You can be whatever you want. Me, registered republican, fiscal conservative married to a cafeteria catholic. But those are just labels which I don't always conform to.

I guess I'd be a nontraditional (fuckin labels). Probably influenced by the 60's and 70's and a very independent mother. Both partners should contribute equally to the relationship as their abilities allow. Financially, house up keep and maintenance, raising the kids, ............ 

BTW, you are allowed to ignore Brian.

Stay around and keep talking to us!

[Brian37]

Welcome to the forum.

You can be whatever you want. Me, registered republican, fiscal conservative married to a cafeteria catholic. But those are just labels which I don't always conform to.

I guess I'd be a nontraditional (fuckin labels). Probably influenced by the 60's and 70's and a very independent mother. Both partners should contribute equally to the relationship as their abilities allow. Financially, house up keep and maintenance, raising the kids, ............ 

BTW, you are allowed to ignore Brian.

Stay around and keep talking to us!

This right here should prove that "atheist" merely means "off" having nothing to do with gender rolls or economics.

Sorry Mr Brewer. My mother grew up in the same generation as "buck up, be a man, just do it". I could give a shit less. She also was a mostly lifetime voting republican.

I do know however, if it were not for her, I would have been on the streets long ago.

It is not a matter of both partners should. That is bullshit. Both partners should know what they are getting into before the relationship. You tell me what would be wrong if a female paid the bills and the man was not equal in pay? 

You tell me what would be wrong with say a man staying home and raising the kids? You tell me what would be wrong if a woman made more than a man? I do know from my own experience BOTH my X wife and my mom supported me and I have no problem being in a subordinate roll rather than leadership.

A penis and vagina don't determine who does what. Consent, communication and ability do. 

I've seen lots of shitty men who claim to be in the role of husband or parent. I've seen lots of awesome women taking the lead too.

[Whateverist]

Hey Everyone! 

I wanted to come on here because I wanted to get some opinions 

I never grew up very religious (although my family did celebrate christmas), but in my teens I considered believing in God and got very serious about being a Christian. I even was a Mormon at one point. 

During that time I dated someone and he was atheist. He was the first atheist I date and he grew up as an atheist. 

We discussed how important my faith was, but thankfully and eventually since we were dating I decided to look into what he believed (or rather didn't believe). I got a ton of books on atheism and read about it. About a year after we dated I decided to go with logic and abandoned my belief in God. It was probably the best thing I decided to do. Two years ago I started college and am still in college. I am 29 now and after a long time devoting myself to magical crap I became a logical person. Education only helped me become a more logical thinker. 

I am still with the same man and we're engaged now. Going to be 4 years together soon. 

What I'm curious about is the fact that I still cling to the idea of traditional marriage and traditional gender roles. Me and my fiance have always lived in a traditional relationship. He makes a good income and I go to school. I clean and cook, but I enjoy doing things like that. As a Christian I always had a basis in God for how to behave in a relationship and be a good girlfriend (or soon to be wife).. now that I am a non believer I still believe in traditional roles but I've taken God out of the mix. 


I am wondering if there actually exist atheist like me. Are there Christians who turned atheist and still believe in traditional gender roles? I can't find anything online about a conservative atheist or an atheist who have traditional roles. 

To me it's clearly possible to be a traditionalist (even if you're female) and not be Christian 
Just like it's possible to be an atheist with a moral compass

Atheists can have every imaginable opinion about everything else under the sun.  Atheism isn't a way of life.  It is just the absence of god belief.

I don't personally get your outlook.  I'm much more liberal than you about gender roles and probably everything else.  But then I don't expect others to see things the way I do or act as I do.  Why do you?

[brewer]

This right hear should prove that "atheist" merely means "off" having nothing to do with gender rolls or economics.

Sorry Mr Brewer. My mother grew up in the same generation as "buck up, be a man, just do it". I could give a shit less. She also was a mostly lifetime voting republican.

I do know however, if it were not for her, I would have been on the streets long ago.

It is not a matter of both partners should. That is bullshit. Both partners should know what they are getting into before the relationship. You tell me what would be wrong if a female paid the bills and the man was not equal in pay? 

You tell me what would be wrong with say a man staying home and raising the kids? You tell me what would be wrong if a woman made more than a man? I do know from my own experience BOTH my X wife and my mom supported me and I have no problem being in a subordinate roll rather than leadership.

A penis and vagina don't determine who does what. Consent, communication and ability do. 

I've seen lots of shitty men who claim to be in the role of husband or parent. I've seen lots of awesome women taking the lead too.

I know you could give shit shit less because you lack the ability, you're demonstrating that right now. Did you miss the "as abilities allow"? 

What makes you think my mother was not the major bread winner some years you gigantic ass? 

And I'm quite positive that you've never had to ability to take care of yourself. I don't think you are even now. 

Why would a woman purposefully ingest an element that causes neurological damage? hehehe

[Brian37]

This right hear should prove that "atheist" merely means "off" having nothing to do with gender rolls or economics.

Sorry Mr Brewer. My mother grew up in the same generation as "buck up, be a man, just do it". I could give a shit less. She also was a mostly lifetime voting republican.

I do know however, if it were not for her, I would have been on the streets long ago.

It is not a matter of both partners should. That is bullshit. Both partners should know what they are getting into before the relationship. You tell me what would be wrong if a female paid the bills and the man was not equal in pay? 

You tell me what would be wrong with say a man staying home and raising the kids? You tell me what would be wrong if a woman made more than a man? I do know from my own experience BOTH my X wife and my mom supported me and I have no problem being in a subordinate roll rather than leadership.

A penis and vagina don't determine who does what. Consent, communication and ability do. 

I've seen lots of shitty men who claim to be in the role of husband or parent. I've seen lots of awesome women taking the lead too.

I know you could give shit shit less because you lack the ability, you're demonstrating that right now. Did you miss the "as abilities allow"? 

What makes you think my mother was not the major bread winner some years you gigantic ass? 

And I'm quite positive that you've never had to ability to take care of yourself. I don't think you are even now. 

Why would a woman purposefully ingest an element that causes neurological damage? hehehe

No asshole, you demonstrated your insecurity not me. I could give one shit less what you think of who has paid my bills. I think you do, and that there means you do buy into gender rolls.

Equal at best is not the same as equal. Equal is when you are willing to be lead by a female and supported by a female. I have been and I have no problem with that. I think you do. 

CONSENT is what matters, not plumbing. 

Your problem is you ARE assuming that every male in our species is inferior if they get help from a female.

[KevinM1]

Hey Everyone! 

I wanted to come on here because I wanted to get some opinions 

I never grew up very religious (although my family did celebrate christmas), but in my teens I considered believing in God and got very serious about being a Christian. I even was a Mormon at one point. 

During that time I dated someone and he was atheist. He was the first atheist I date and he grew up as an atheist. 

We discussed how important my faith was, but thankfully and eventually since we were dating I decided to look into what he believed (or rather didn't believe). I got a ton of books on atheism and read about it. About a year after we dated I decided to go with logic and abandoned my belief in God. It was probably the best thing I decided to do. Two years ago I started college and am still in college. I am 29 now and after a long time devoting myself to magical crap I became a logical person. Education only helped me become a more logical thinker. 

I am still with the same man and we're engaged now. Going to be 4 years together soon. 

What I'm curious about is the fact that I still cling to the idea of traditional marriage and traditional gender roles. Me and my fiance have always lived in a traditional relationship. He makes a good income and I go to school. I clean and cook, but I enjoy doing things like that. As a Christian I always had a basis in God for how to behave in a relationship and be a good girlfriend (or soon to be wife).. now that I am a non believer I still believe in traditional roles but I've taken God out of the mix. 


I am wondering if there actually exist atheist like me. Are there Christians who turned atheist and still believe in traditional gender roles? I can't find anything online about a conservative atheist or an atheist who have traditional roles. 

To me it's clearly possible to be a traditionalist (even if you're female) and not be Christian 
Just like it's possible to be an atheist with a moral compass

Atheism is simply the lack of belief in gods.  That's it.  It's not a philosophy, there are no tenets, no hierarchy, nothing that binds us as atheists except for the lack of belief in gods.  So, there are conservative atheists, liberal atheists, libertarian atheists, communist atheists, anarchist atheists, etc.  Atheism doesn't define us, and, frankly, it tends to be really low on the list of terms that can define us (although the freshly deconverted seem to be rah rah about their atheism, but that usually passes with time).

So, with all that said, relationship advice: good relationships are based on open and honest communication.  It doesn't matter if it's a business relationship, a friendly relationship, or intimate relationship... if the people involved are honest and can express themselves with that honesty, then the battle is already won.

As long as you and your future husband can talk to each other about the important stuff, then the rest is gravy.  Do what you think will make the relationship work and make you happy.  It's really as simple as that.

[Succubus]

Of course there can be socially conservative atheists. Just like there can be economically conservative atheists. 

But if you are going to talk about it I can point out in a few words why both are just as bad as any theist bullshit.

1. My life is none of your fucking business as far as social issues.

2. If "fuck you I got mine" worked on economics Somalia would be a world power.

Why would you want to believe old bullshit and simply adapt it because someone sold it to you?

If you cant handle a female wearing what they want, or making more than you, or even supporting you financially what do you want me to say? You are just as bad as any right wing theist.

If you think that by a liberal theist or liberal atheist on ECONOMICS is claiming we want a nanny state like Stalin or Cuba what do you want me to say to that? I cant tell you flat out it would not be, "You got us". No my response would be "FUCK YOU".

I could give as shit less who pays the bills or who wears what, as long as it works and the parties involved consent. No, I do not think that the rich deserve to dictate economic policy but no, that does not make me anti private sector. 

Yes I have seen both socially conservative and economically conservative atheists in my past, and unfortunately they do exist. But if you think I am here to coddle your insecurities, you are barking up the wrong tree.

Are you in the right thread?

[brewer]

No asshole, you demonstrated your insecurity not me. I could give one shit less what you think of who has paid my bills. I think you do, and that there means you do buy into gender rolls.

Equal at best is not the same as equal. Equal is when you are willing to be lead by a female and supported by a female. I have been and I have no problem with that. I think you do. 

CONSENT is what matters, not plumbing. 

Your problem is you ARE assuming that every male in our species is inferior if they get help from a female.

Keep digging your hole Brian.

At times I have been supported by a female. 

Nope, I just think you're inferior, gender has nothing to do with it. Time for you to stop being a victim child.

[bennyboy]

I fully support more "traditional" roles. I think they're the best way.

However, I definitely do not support making people fit into or live up to those roles.