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Testimony is Evidence
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 (August 24, 2017 at 7:45 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:(August 24, 2017 at 7:32 pm)Khemikal Wrote: -and there's the crux of it, testimony..at it's absolute best... is a hanging claim. A story, floated. What we corroborate testimony with, however, is the evidence which lends credence to the claim. Some people swear by Tylenol. The shit does nothing for me. So, yeah. There I would agree with you. Hell, there are people who insist that acupuncture works, too.  (August 24, 2017 at 7:51 pm)Khemikal Wrote: That wouldn't be any logic of mine, and I'd weep for medicine if it relied on testimonials. I think that what you're trying to refer to here would be quack treatment. I can see how you'd mistake one for the other.......you're the kind of guy that would argue for exorcism as a treatment for epilepsy. I see that you insist on doubling down on stupid. The only way to quantify a qualitative effect is by compiling multiple qualitative reports, i.e. testimonials. That's the only way to know if various treatments work for certain types of illnesses like chronic pain and depression. 
There's a place for subjective experience in evidentiary proceedings. The issue is, where is that place?
That place, my friends, is low on the totem pole. To use Wooters's point about pain, does that explain placebo? I might feel better because Mom gave me chicken soup when I had a cold, but did that counteract the cold? Did it reduce the pain? The subjectivity of testimony is exactly what lends it unreliability. RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 24, 2017 at 9:27 pm
(This post was last modified: August 24, 2017 at 9:27 pm by Neo-Scholastic.)
(August 24, 2017 at 8:56 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: That place, my friends, is low on the totem pole. To use Wooters's point about pain, does that explain placebo? Yes. It has been proven time and time again that placebos work and can indeed be used as an effective treatment even if the patient knows he is taking a placebo! It is not the actual ingredients; but rather manner of their presentation that has an effect.
Is this honestly what you think that medical treatments, of any kind, are based on. That "It worked for me" satisfies the fda? That a surgeon will cut into someone, because he's been assured that the anesthesiologist has collected a pile of testimonials....
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RE: Testimony is Evidence
August 24, 2017 at 9:56 pm
(This post was last modified: August 24, 2017 at 9:57 pm by Thumpalumpacus.)
(August 24, 2017 at 9:27 pm)Neo-Scholastic Wrote:(August 24, 2017 at 8:56 pm)Thumpalumpacus Wrote: That place, my friends, is low on the totem pole. To use Wooters's point about pain, does that explain placebo? And what placebo, Chad, is it that you take? Do the "actual ingredients" matter? I think you just admitted a fatal subjectivity. Have a nice evening. 
They say there's three sides to an argument. Yours, mine and the truth.
Disclaimer: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you choose to understand.
 (August 24, 2017 at 10:04 pm)Anomalocaris Wrote:(August 24, 2017 at 10:03 pm)Nymphadora Wrote: They say there's three sides to an argument. Yours, mine and the truth. Have any evidence to back that up? Disclaimer: I am only responsible for what I say, not what you choose to understand.
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