What is morality?

[Little Rik]

Welcome back, MM.  

I've got to say I don't think any metaphysical claim can be persuasive which is built up from the definition of the words we use, not that I expect you to refrain from trying.

That is rather bizarre What.

Time and time again most atheists say that we should stick to the words as defined in the vocabulary.
Now instead you say the opposite.
How can anybody make an atheist happy then?

Nothing works for you guys unless it goes along with your belief of the day.  

[Anomalocaris]

Define it in a thorough manner.

It is the casting away of the Koran.  All else is mere detail.

[Brian37]

Welcome back, MM.  

I've got to say I don't think any metaphysical claim can be persuasive which is built up from the definition of the words we use, not that I expect you to refrain from trying.

That is rather bizarre What.

Time and time again most atheists say that we should stick to the words as defined in the vocabulary.
Now instead you say the opposite.
How can anybody make an atheist happy then?

Nothing works for you guys unless it goes along with your belief of the day.  

Quite your whining. Nobody is going to barbecue your kittens.

It is not a matter of making us happy, it is a matter for you to want facts for yourself. Of course theists claims bother us, because we compare modern scientific facts to the factless naked assertions of antiquity. Just like it would rightfully bother you if your family member, neighbor or co worker repeated every day "Thor is the cause of lightening".

Yes theists claims bother us just like it would bother me if you or anyone went around every day repeatedly claiming, "The New England Patriots beat the Chicago Cubs in the Stanley Cup."

The biological reason humans have intense feelings can be several things, indoctrination, drug use, brain defect. But the main reason humans have "spiritual" "experiences" is that they are falsely told before that they can develop critical thinking skills that that is a real thing.

I am giving you the NATURAL psychological biological reasons humans come to these false conclusions. WHEN your brain releases certain chemicals, naturally or through stimuli like drugs, your brain releases chemicals that make you feel good. Depending on intensity that feeling can become quite addictive and your brain will want more of that. Even if it is not drug induced. It is no different than why a kid is happy when they think about Santa bringing them gifts.

If you want to believe something badly enough, you will. And yes, false beliefs can produce good feelings and intense feelings that end up releasing real chemicals that makes you feel good.

Do you want to live in a fact based reality, or a fantasy?

[Little Rik]

Anything that help you to progress spiritually speaking is morality.
Anything that take you back spiritually speaking is immorality.  

Poppycock.

"Spirituality" is also highly subjective to point of view. Humans in antiquity would get high off of eating or smoking plants and think they were talking to the otherworld. It is a gibberish superstitious word.

People can become rich simply by stealing and say that they are rich.
Of course they are rich, who would disagree with that.
At the same time people can be aware of the spiritual dimension simply by using drugs.
How can we disagree with that also?
That's not the point Brian.
Morality doesn't work like that and if you are not completely dumb you already should have got my message.  

If you feel an intense sense of awe, wonder, comfort or love, that is not "spirituality", that is your BODY releasing chemicals that stimulate a positive mood, in a real evolutionary context, thinking about things that give you comfort can boost your immune system, even if those ideas are completely false.

You can have comfort or a wonderful time by doing so many different things which may have nothing to do with spiritual progress like having sex or eating good food or going holiday or a myriad of other thing.
You probably never thought about it Brian, did you?  

I have no "spirituality". I do have a deep appreciation for a pretty sunset, clear night time sky, when my cat curls up on my lap, but especially the time I had with my mother while she was alive. I have no need to chalk any of those beautiful things up to hollow cliche words rooted in superstition and mythology.
I find reality far more satisfying than dusty old books written by humans who didn't know where the sun went at night.

Most atheists don't really know what they are talking about.
Anyone which lack any sort of spirituality can not possibly be at peace with him-herself and therefore enjoy a pretty sunset or express a genuine smile.
No way.
Have you ever seen a rapist or a murderer have a true, natural and genuine smile?  

[Brian37]

Poppycock.

"Spirituality" is also highly subjective to point of view. Humans in antiquity would get high off of eating or smoking plants and think they were talking to the otherworld. It is a gibberish superstitious word.

People can become rich simply by stealing and say that they are rich.
Of course they are rich, who would disagree with that.
At the same time people can be aware of the spiritual dimension simply by using drugs.
How can we disagree with that also?
That's not the point Brian.
Morality doesn't work like that and if you are not completely dumb you already should have got my message.  

If you feel an intense sense of awe, wonder, comfort or love, that is not "spirituality", that is your BODY releasing chemicals that stimulate a positive mood, in a real evolutionary context, thinking about things that give you comfort can boost your immune system, even if those ideas are completely false.

You can have comfort or a wonderful time by doing so many different things which may have nothing to do with spiritual progress like having sex or eating good food or going holiday or a myriad of other thing.
You probably never thought about it Brian, did you?  

I have no "spirituality". I do have a deep appreciation for a pretty sunset, clear night time sky, when my cat curls up on my lap, but especially the time I had with my mother while she was alive. I have no need to chalk any of those beautiful things up to hollow cliche words rooted in superstition and mythology.
I find reality far more satisfying than dusty old books written by humans who didn't know where the sun went at night.

Most atheists don't really know what they are talking about.
Anyone which lack any sort of spirituality can not possibly be at peace with him-herself and therefore enjoy a pretty sunset or express a genuine smile.
No way.
Have you ever seen a rapist or a murderer have a true, natural and genuine smile?  

You want to lecture an atheist about rape when there are vs in the bible that say at best, fine the perp? Show me the verse in the bible that gives prison time to a rapist, EXACT VERSE. 

The bible says NOTHING about prison time for rapists. Do you want a real reason as to why rape is seen as bad?

Now, do you want a real explanation as to why rapists do what they do, or do you stupidly believe that a guy with a pitchfork screws with the neurons in the perp's brain?

Yea evil people smile so what. No Lex Luther or Darth Vader making people do horrible things, and no Satan doing it either. Why does it bother you so much that I can reject evil without chalking it up to comic book villains?

[Little Rik]

That is rather bizarre What.

Time and time again most atheists say that we should stick to the words as defined in the vocabulary.
Now instead you say the opposite.
How can anybody make an atheist happy then?

Nothing works for you guys unless it goes along with your belief of the day.  

Quite your whining. Nobody is going to barbecue your kittens.

It is not a matter of making us happy, it is a matter for you to want facts for yourself. Of course theists claims bother us, because we compare modern scientific facts to the factless naked assertions of antiquity. Just like it would rightfully bother you if your family member, neighbor or co worker repeated every day "Thor is the cause of lightening".

Yes theists claims bother us just like it would bother me if you or anyone went around every day repeatedly claiming, "The New England Patriots beat the Chicago Cubs in the Stanley Cup."

The biological reason humans have intense feelings can be several things, indoctrination, drug use, brain defect. But the main reason humans have "spiritual" "experiences" is that they are falsely told before that they can develop critical thinking skills that that is a real thing.

I am giving you the NATURAL psychological biological reasons humans come to these false conclusions. WHEN your brain releases certain chemicals, naturally or through stimuli like drugs, your brain releases chemicals that make you feel good. Depending on intensity that feeling can become quite addictive and your brain will want more of that. Even if it is not drug induced. It is no different than why a kid is happy when they think about Santa bringing them gifts.

If you want to believe something badly enough, you will. And yes, false beliefs can produce good feelings and intense feelings that end up releasing real chemicals that makes you feel good.

Do you want to live in a fact based reality, or a fantasy?

Fantasy is what atheism is all about Brian.
100% fantasy.

Addictions can take you quite high.
No question about that but what this has to do with morality?
Morality is build upon real natural and genuine effort not by jumping the queue and resorting to tricks.
In the spiritual world tricks do not work.
Everybody knows that drugs make you feel great at the expenses of your heath and at the expenses of
your mental and spiritual well being.
Morality lead to a permanent feeling of well being not to an occasional feeling that come and go as you use a chemical form of masturbation.  

[Brian37]

Quite your whining. Nobody is going to barbecue your kittens.

It is not a matter of making us happy, it is a matter for you to want facts for yourself. Of course theists claims bother us, because we compare modern scientific facts to the factless naked assertions of antiquity. Just like it would rightfully bother you if your family member, neighbor or co worker repeated every day "Thor is the cause of lightening".

Yes theists claims bother us just like it would bother me if you or anyone went around every day repeatedly claiming, "The New England Patriots beat the Chicago Cubs in the Stanley Cup."

The biological reason humans have intense feelings can be several things, indoctrination, drug use, brain defect. But the main reason humans have "spiritual" "experiences" is that they are falsely told before that they can develop critical thinking skills that that is a real thing.

I am giving you the NATURAL psychological biological reasons humans come to these false conclusions. WHEN your brain releases certain chemicals, naturally or through stimuli like drugs, your brain releases chemicals that make you feel good. Depending on intensity that feeling can become quite addictive and your brain will want more of that. Even if it is not drug induced. It is no different than why a kid is happy when they think about Santa bringing them gifts.

If you want to believe something badly enough, you will. And yes, false beliefs can produce good feelings and intense feelings that end up releasing real chemicals that makes you feel good.

Do you want to live in a fact based reality, or a fantasy?

Fantasy is what atheism is all about Brian.
100% fantasy.

Addictions can take you quite high.
No question about that but what this has to do with morality?
Morality is build upon real natural and genuine effort not by jumping the queue and resorting to tricks.
In the spiritual world tricks do not work.
Everybody knows that drugs make you feel great at the expenses of your heath and at the expenses of
your mental and spiritual well being.
Morality lead to a permanent feeling of well being not to an occasional feeling that come and go as you use a chemical form of masturbation.  

Yea ok, said the one whom values a book with men magically popping out of dirt, women magically popping out of a man's rib, talking snakes, talking donkeys, talking bushes, genocide of the Egyptian first born males, mass genocide of a fictional flood that ends up requiring incest to repopulate the planet. Magic babies born without a second set of DNA with super powers whom magically survives rigor mortis 30 years later. 

You could be trying to convince me  Yoda and Harry Potter are real too.

I am sorry someone sold you that myth before you developed critical thinking skills, but that is your baggage, not mine.

[Little Rik]

People can become rich simply by stealing and say that they are rich.
Of course they are rich, who would disagree with that.
At the same time people can be aware of the spiritual dimension simply by using drugs.
How can we disagree with that also?
That's not the point Brian.
Morality doesn't work like that and if you are not completely dumb you already should have got my message.  




You can have comfort or a wonderful time by doing so many different things which may have nothing to do with spiritual progress like having sex or eating good food or going holiday or a myriad of other thing.
You probably never thought about it Brian, did you?  




Most atheists don't really know what they are talking about.
Anyone which lack any sort of spirituality can not possibly be at peace with him-herself and therefore enjoy a pretty sunset or express a genuine smile.
No way.
Have you ever seen a rapist or a murderer have a true, natural and genuine smile?  

You want to lecture an atheist about rape when there are vs in the bible that say at best, fine the perp? Show me the verse in the bible that gives prison time to a rapist, EXACT VERSE. 

The bible says NOTHING about prison time for rapists. Do you want a real reason as to why rape is seen as bad?

Now, do you want a real explanation as to why rapists do what they do, or do you stupidly believe that a guy with a pitchfork screws with the neurons in the perp's brain?

Yea evil people smile so what. No Lex Luther or Darth Vader making people do horrible things, and no Satan doing it either. Why does it bother you so much that I can reject evil without chalking it up to comic book villains?

1) I do not follow the Bible Brian.
I do not follow religions so please leave the Bible alone or argue about the Bible with Christians not with me.

This doesn't mean that the Bible is wrong.
It may even be good and it may be that those who interpret it may interpret wrong.
I don't know.
I rather follow something else a lot more practical than theoretical as the so called Holy books.


2) Sure, even evil people smile but their smiles are not true, natural and genuine.
Unless you are a total idiot you can easily find out whether their smiles are coming from their heart or their backside.  

[Brian37]

You want to lecture an atheist about rape when there are vs in the bible that say at best, fine the perp? Show me the verse in the bible that gives prison time to a rapist, EXACT VERSE. 

The bible says NOTHING about prison time for rapists. Do you want a real reason as to why rape is seen as bad?

Now, do you want a real explanation as to why rapists do what they do, or do you stupidly believe that a guy with a pitchfork screws with the neurons in the perp's brain?

Yea evil people smile so what. No Lex Luther or Darth Vader making people do horrible things, and no Satan doing it either. Why does it bother you so much that I can reject evil without chalking it up to comic book villains?

1) I do not follow the Bible Brian.
I do not follow religions so please leave the Bible alone or argue about the Bible with Christians not with me.

This doesn't mean that the Bible is wrong.
It may even be good and it may be that those who interpret it may interpret wrong.
I don't know.
I rather follow something else a lot more practical than theoretical as the so called Holy books.


2) Sure, even evil people smile but their smiles are not true, natural and genuine.
Unless you are a total idiot you can easily find out whether their smiles are coming from their heart or their backside.  

A smile is a smile, fake or genuine, a evil person still does not need a guy with a pitchfork to explain why they smile. 

The smile can be about greed, or lust for power, but it is still a smile. 

This is why you cant understand why rape happens and some victims can be drawn into their trap.

It is a bullshit stereotype to think evil is magical. Rape is not about a ground troll causing a rapist to do it. Rape is a result of prior abuse of the rapist growing up and or personality defect that causes them to lack empathy for others. Rape is about power and control, not the sex itself.

Rapists, like child molesters can look very normal and innocent. They can be your uncle, your baby sitter, your coach your teacher your preacher. The don't always look like street winos or vampires. 

The reason the victim feels pain, isn't because of God or Satan either. The reason the victim feels both physical pain and psychological pain, is that the rape takes away the victims control over their own body, it is theft of autonomy. Raping kid or adult is an assault on their sense of security. THAT is what makes rape and child molestation BAD. 

Explaining why a criminal does what they do is not an excuse in the same way knowing the conditions that cause a hurricane isn't saying you want one.

I am sorry someone sold you the idea that your religion and God belief explains why good and bad happen. And I am sorry the REAL natural explanation above isn't as satisfying to you as your Super Hero vs Super villain, but it is reality.

And I don't need any lectures from you about rape having had my mom and both my sisters go through that. I am very aware of the real reasons those sickos do what they do. 

Satan does not explain shit. Human psychology does.

[Mystic]

Everything is good. Doing 3rd year this fall (5 courses and they are all hard), and hope fully will finish degree soon, and finish strong.

Thanks!

How have you been my friend?

What is your degree for if you don't mind us asking?

Computer science.