More Race Hysteria from SJW's

[The Grand Nudger]

It's not as simple as them being intolerant of intolerance, it's their behavior towards their own and towards their opponents and the way they oppose them. Both of which I've covered previously. 

How do you think they should treat bigots?  I laugh in their face and remind them that they're a joke.  That's my thing, lol.  

Just what I said. She wanted to open up conversation with her political adversaries and in return she got rail roaded by her own compatriots for not towing the line.

I don't think you did even the quickest google search on that.  It would be impossible for you to think that you've summarized what happened, with the above, if you had.  She got "railroaded" for shit she took it upon herself to say, things that were so diametrically in opposition to what she had cultivated her base from that the subsequent fallout was an inevitability.  Thankfully, she landed softly in the much more profitable alt right..and now runs cover for her anti-feminist boyfriend.....lol. 

Gee, can't see why -that- might have gotten her fans feathers ruffled.  

I think both sides are fostering the us and them mentality is what I mean. Sure it's the bigot's main issue, but does acting like them towards them help or exacerbate the situation? I can't propose a solution myself because it's beyond me but the answer is obvious to this question. 

You're going to have to be a little more specific as to what "acting like them" means.  "The situation", as I see it, is that there are bigots amongst us.  More than we'd like to admit...and they notoriously wont admit it to themselves.  Accommodating them exacerbates that situation.  

Censorship, for one. 

Such as....?

Definitely better than how it came across at least. 

I aim to please.

What is it that you're after? Names? Addresses? I've described the general lay of the land pretty well in previous posts. 

Sure, a name of a specific sjw being part of the problem with sjw culture.  I think it's important to a discussion of the problem with sjw culture to see an actual example of an sjw actually being a problem.  We may not ultimately agree, but at least I'd have a better idea what you're referring to.  

I'd say it does but that's subjective isn't it? 

Not really, and I get pretty aggressive when I see a person building a back door to exit from........

Sure, as a business owner or school you can screen things as you see fit and as a citizen you can protest or pull your patronage but if you are actively silencing someone who has attained permission from the proper channels at that venue or has funded use of a space themselves by attacking them or charging the stage, taking their mic away or causing such a scene that the police shut it down... what kind of precedence does that set?

If protesters manage to cause such a scene that police shut down a bigot rally....I call that effective protest.  If someone attacks a speaker, I call it assault.  Pretty sure our laws do too.  

What can you expect when enough people disagree with you or someone that espouses your views? I'm not even talking "the golden rule" here I'm saying do you not think these things could be used against you as well? Do you think people wouldn't take notice of this being an accepted practice? 

I can expect to find my own voice drowned by all of theirs.  Bigots -do- use our system to subvert our system.  To them, that's pretty much the only value of our system......otherwise they think it's pretty shitty for not being bigoted enough for their liking.

"We don't agree with you so you don't get to speak." 

Probably not an accurate summary of their reasons for refusing a given person a platform.............

There are plenty of people I don't agree with, bigots chief among them. That being said, they can speak until they're blue in the face, especially if they paid to do so. 

-and they do.......but..really, whether or not they paid their money to say racist shit to a crowd means very little to me.  They can speak until they're blue in the face and protesters can drown their voice out chanting their own slogans.  No amount of money changes that..and if you're going to comment on silencing the opposition....referring to monies paid probably isn't a good idea, since you'd be talking about a person paying enough money, literally, to make sure there is no counterpoint present.  

Maybe it's because you're wording it like a dickhead would. The second time around no less. Say what you mean.

If it helps, imagine me smiling with whiskey in hand.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Wallym, I removed my kudos so that the lying slanderers won't accuse you of being a racist.

Passive-aggressive post spotted, itt.

[Pat Mustard]

I'm pretty sure Wooters is not a "far-right racist."

You'd be wrong based on his posts here. He evidences both severe racism and severe neo-nazi tendencies from his very own words.

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You either like to see the best in everyone

Not really, C_L's a bit like what the Irish far right catholics have managed to create, Cora Sherlock, a very soft spoken superficially mild and pleasant person who when she lets her guard down ends up being full (link) Hitler Jugend Defenceand Opus Dei religious nutball.

In other words she really doesn't give two shits if a person is good, as long as they are doctrinaire.

[Catholic_Lady]

I'm pretty sure Wooters is not a "far-right racist."

You'd be wrong based on his posts here. He evidences both severe racism and severe neo-nazi tendencies from his very own words.

Would you mind copying and pasting his words that make you say he's severely racist and severely neo nazi?

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You either like to see the best in everyone

Not really, C_L's a bit like what the Irish far right catholics have managed to create, Cora Sherlock, a very soft spoken superficially mild and pleasant person who when she lets her guard down ends up being full (link) Hitler Jugend Defenceand Opus Dei religious nutball.

In other words she really doesn't give two shits if a person is good, as long as they are doctrinaire.

Oh I'm a neo Nazi too apparently lol.

[Bob Kelso]

How do you think they should treat bigots?  I laugh in their face and remind them that they're a joke.  That's my thing, lol.

*shrugs*
Couldn't tell you how, just know that smearing shit with more shit doesn't clean up the mess.  

I don't think you did even the quickest google search on that.  It would be impossible for you to think that you've summarized what happened, with the above, if you had.  She got "railroaded" for shit she took it upon herself to say, things that were so diametrically in opposition to what she had cultivated her base from that the subsequent fallout was an inevitability.  Thankfully, she landed softly in the much more profitable alt right..and now runs cover for her anti-feminist boyfriend.....lol. 

Gee, can't see why -that- might have gotten her fans feathers ruffled.

You're right I didn't google search it I got it straight from the horse's mouth.

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Yep she's such a greedy alt-right monster.

You're going to have to be a little more specific as to what "acting like them" means.  "The situation", as I see it, is that there are bigots amongst us.  More than we'd like to admit...and they notoriously wont admit it to themselves.  Accommodating them exacerbates that situation.

Are you really acting* so dense as to not know how bigots act?

*because I know you do

Such as....?

A bit old but came to mind first;




If that doesn't match your criteria then this recent BBC interview (yes it's happening in the U.K. too) should be sufficient.
https://youtu.be/boCmsa6wRas

Sure, a name of a specific sjw being part of the problem with sjw culture.  I think it's important to a discussion of the problem with sjw culture to see an actual example of an sjw actually being a problem.  We may not ultimately agree, but at least I'd have a better idea what you're referring to.

I've got a great one: Anita Sarkeesian, a proven liar and a needlessly divisive person. Anyone remember the shitstorm that was Gamergate? A right mess on both sides no doubt, but she was the root of the problem because she couldn't be bothered enough to do actual research on the games she was talking about or even be honest about her interest in games. I don't want to hear that she isn't a big deal either, the woman spoke on TED Talks and with the UN to talk about how her bloody feelings were being hurt on the internet.

If she doesn't do it for you then feminist activist Big Red is another (albeit older) example.

So is Melissa "I need some muscle over here" Click who censored a journalist at a protest at Mizzou. Edit: Oh and let's not forget inciting violence.

I could go on.

Not really, and I get pretty aggressive when I see a person building a back door to exit from........

Do I really need to bring out the "we got a badass over here" meme? C'mon Khem.

If I'm done talking or feel as if I'm in the wrong you'll hear it from me straight up, no back doors needed.

If protesters manage to cause such a scene that police shut down a bigot rally....I call that effective protest.  If someone attacks a speaker, I call it assault.  Pretty sure our laws do too. 
I can expect to find my own voice drowned by all of theirs.  Bigots -do- use our system to subvert our system.  To them, that's pretty much the only value of our system......otherwise they think it's pretty shitty for not being bigoted enough for their liking.

Fair enough if that's how you see it, honestly we just disagree on this so much I don't see the point of taking it further. (See I told you)

"We don't agree with you so you don't get to speak." 

Probably not an accurate summary of their reasons for refusing a given person a platform.............

But "distilling" me to "they're intolerant of their intolerance" was? Guess it works both ways.

-and they do.......but..really, whether or not they paid their money to say racist shit to a crowd means very little to me.  They can speak until they're blue in the face and protesters can drown their voice out chanting their own slogans.  No amount of money changes that..and if you're going to comment on silencing the opposition....referring to monies paid probably isn't a good idea, since you'd be talking about a person paying enough money, literally, to make sure there is no counterpoint present.

Sadly that'd probably be the answer to continued "no platforming" and I'd rather it not come to that but again we disagree on this in a big way.

If it helps, imagine me smiling with whiskey in hand.

I'll take a rum thanks.

[bennyboy]

You'd be wrong based on his posts here. He evidences both severe racism and severe neo-nazi tendencies from his very own words.

Would you mind copying and pasting his words that make you say he's severely racist and severely neo nazi?

---

Not really, C_L's a bit like what the Irish far right catholics have managed to create, Cora Sherlock, a very soft spoken superficially mild and pleasant person who when she lets her guard down ends up being full (link) Hitler Jugend Defenceand Opus Dei religious nutball.

In other words she really doesn't give two shits if a person is good, as long as they are doctrinaire.

Oh I'm a neo Nazi too apparently lol.

I'd also like to see the actual damning posts-- which are often mentioned, but I have yet to actually see them quoted.  It may be that Tazzycorn's and others' interpretations OF what you guys have said have led them to essentially call you witches.

There's certainly an overlap in this thread, in the Charlottesville thread, and so on.  It seems clear that at least in these forums, there's some parallel between religious affiliations, political affiliation, and stances on race issues.  However, it seems to me very likely that you and Wooters are probably more moderate than your friends, your political peers and so on, and that this is a big part of the reason that you frequent these atheist forums despite being theists (or at least deists?)

Tazzycorn's post, Tizheruk's before, and a few others, while they point out some trends in your positions which I think are probably real enough, also REVEAL a trend, the one I was talking about earlier: the tendency to demonize people who, while they don't exactly say anything deeply offensive, seem to be on the wrong side of the dogma.  "Nazi" is pretty obviously code for "someone who doesn't fully endorse all the positions which we think everyone must take."  In other words, there are some positions which are not intellectual ones, but are flags for membership or refusal of membership in that group of people whose opinions are worthy of consideration.  That's dogma, and you are therefore a heretic by that standard.

[The Grand Nudger]

*shrugs*
Couldn't tell you how, just know that smearing shit with more shit doesn't clean up the mess.  

Agreed.  No amount of my poking fun at them makes them go away or stop being bigots.

You're right I didn't google search it I got it straight from the horse's mouth.


Yep she's such a greedy alt-right monster.

I think you might want to explore why the people who abandoned her did so, rather than her own version of events.  

Are you really acting* so dense as to not know how bigots act?

*because I know you do

I'm just trying to find out what specifically about how bigots act you're referring to.  If it amounts to "I think that sjws are acting like assholes"....well, I'm sure that's got to be true at least some of the time..but I don't know why it would be a useful criticism of sjws, or a reason to liken them to any bigot they oppose.  Oppose bigotry, but be nice about it?  So..yeah, clarification is required..because your comments in that regard might be meaningful but they might also be a bit ridiculous.

A bit old but came to mind first;

Pulling a fire alarm?  That was pretty clever.  Illegal too.  Do you equate radical feminism with sjw culture?  

If that doesn't match your criteria then this recent BBC interview (yes it's happening in the U.K. too) should be sufficient.

Not really an issue of my criteria..trying to establish yours by the examples so we could have a substantive discussion.   I find that I broadly agree with her on some points.  Freedom of speech is not the freedom to speak wherever you want, and a student body does have a say in what their fees pay for.  There's always some other place to go and be a bigot with their bigot buddies.  

I've got a great one: Anita Sarkeesian, a proven liar and a needlessly divisive person. Anyone remember the shitstorm that was Gamergate? A right mess on both sides no doubt, but she was the root of the problem because she couldn't be bothered enough to do actual research on the games she was talking about or even be honest about her interest in games. I don't want to hear that she isn't a big deal either, the woman spoke on TED Talks and with the UN to talk about how her bloody feelings were being hurt on the internet.

So, again I have to ask..when you speak of sjws..are you thinking specifically or largely of feminists?  

If she doesn't do it for you then feminist activist Big Red is another (albeit older) example.

again with the feminists.

So is Melissa "I need some muscle over here" Click who censored a journalist at a protest at Mizzou.

I could go on.

This is a good one.  Breaks the pattern from before.  Seems that some of the protesters took issue with being filmed.  They wanted a safe space, he wanted a story.  Personally, I side with the reporter on this one, though that's unsurprising.  It begs the question...do you see the creation of or insistence for safe spaces as censorship in the general, or do you see this as a more specific and explicit example of censorship beyond the issue of safe spaces?  What makes this sjw censorship?  I sometimes suspect that "sjw culture" is a dumpster term.  Help dispel that notion.

Do I really need to bring out the "we got a badass over here" meme? C'mon Khem.

If I'm done talking or feel as if I'm in the wrong you'll hear it from me straight up, no back doors needed.

Awesome, then there's no need to waffle over subjectivity.  

Fair enough if that's how you see it, honestly we just disagree on this so much I don't see the point of taking it further. (See I told you)

Well, we don't have to agree on everything, right.  My views on protest aren't the usual fare, and I know that.  If it helps bring us back to something resembling concordance..while I'm openly supportive of methods of protest that others aren't..and even methods that are illegal or violent...I also support the punitive consequences for such acts.  Pulled a fire alarm?  Good job, now go to jail.  Rushed the stage and assaulted a speaker?  Okay, I hope you've got your mugshot face worked out.  Toss a molotov?  Expect to be shot.  

But "distilling" me to "they're intolerant of their intolerance" was? Guess it works both ways.

I asked, you told me it wasn't, now I'm trying to figure out what "acting like the bigots" amounts to.  

Sadly that'd probably be the answer to continued "no platforming" and I'd rather it not come to that but again we disagree on this in a big way.

It happens.

I'll take a rum thanks.

Now it's a party!

[Bob Kelso]

I'd like to respond to this now but I've got some dad stuff to do, then some boyfriend stuff. *cough*

So I'll pick this up in the morning.

[LadyForCamus]

You'd be wrong based on his posts here. He evidences both severe racism and severe neo-nazi tendencies from his very own words.

Would you mind copying and pasting his words that make you say he's severely racist and severely neo nazi?

---

Not really, C_L's a bit like what the Irish far right catholics have managed to create, Cora Sherlock, a very soft spoken superficially mild and pleasant person who when she lets her guard down ends up being full (link) Hitler Jugend Defenceand Opus Dei religious nutball.

In other words she really doesn't give two shits if a person is good, as long as they are doctrinaire.

Oh I'm a neo Nazi too apparently lol.

CL, I lol'd at your kudos to Tazzy's post.  🤣

[Catholic_Lady]

Would you mind copying and pasting his words that make you say he's severely racist and severely neo nazi?

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Oh I'm a neo Nazi too apparently lol.

CL, I lol'd at your kudos to Tazzy's post.  🤣

I'm a masochist like that. Every time he talks to me like shit I kudos it. I liiiike it. 😁

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Would you mind copying and pasting his words that make you say he's severely racist and severely neo nazi?

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Oh I'm a neo Nazi too apparently lol.

I'd also like to see the actual damning posts-- which are often mentioned, but I have yet to actually see them quoted.  It may be that Tazzycorn's and others' interpretations OF what you guys have said have led them to essentially call you witches.

There's certainly an overlap in this thread, in the Charlottesville thread, and so on.  It seems clear that at least in these forums, there's some parallel between religious affiliations, political affiliation, and stances on race issues.  However, it seems to me very likely that you and Wooters are probably more moderate than your friends, your political peers and so on, and that this is a big part of the reason that you frequent these atheist forums despite being theists (or at least deists?)

Tazzycorn's post, Tizheruk's before, and a few others, while they point out some trends in your positions which I think are probably real enough, also REVEAL a trend, the one I was talking about earlier: the tendency to demonize people who, while they don't exactly say anything deeply offensive, seem to be on the wrong side of the dogma.  "Nazi" is pretty obviously code for "someone who doesn't fully endorse all the positions which we think everyone must take."  In other words, there are some positions which are not intellectual ones, but are flags for membership or refusal of membership in that group of people whose opinions are worthy of consideration.  That's dogma, and you are therefore a heretic by that standard.

Honestly I usually agree with most people here regarding the actual race issue at hand. I think the confederate flag is offenssive, i can understand why people want southern statues down, and I dislike white supremacists just as much as the next person.

But I condemn the general quickness people have at calling others racist, and I defend Chad when others say he's a racist and a nazi. Apparently that's all enough for me to earn the title myself lol.