Young Earth Creationism Vs. Science (Statler Waldorf Contd)

[TheDarkestOfAngels]

I'm sure he's busy with something.
Here, maybe I can replicate the experience for you:

TDOA:
You're wrong. There, I've proved you're wrong on everything, plus there's a list of people that agree with me from the Creation Institute/AIG and because they have advanced degrees, their opinion automatically trumps the entire scientific community through nothing other than their opinion.

Zen Badger:
ASC states that clocks are set differently as to allow people on the ground to think that their messages are recieved in half the time and sent out back to earth at 300k km/sec and this allows the machine probes to adjust their telemetry on time despite recieving the changes in half the time its creators expected.
It makes perfect sense if you read that untested and non-empirically evidenced paper written by someone who explicity wants to prove the earth and universe is several million times younger than it actually is, becuase he's just trying to find the truth.

Thor:
How dare you compare me to diarrhea! My god says to love and cherish one another when he's not ruthlessly murdering unbelievers and those outside (and inside) of my christian denomination for not being christians of my exact denomination, which is his right because he's not human and we all deserve it for something we never did that happened well before we were individually created by god and sent to earth.
This means that human life is valuable and god is a loving god for not murdering us harder than he already does!

[Autumnlicious]

Have you consulted alternative sources about Diarrhea?

[Statler Waldorf]

---

I'm sure he's busy with something.
Here, maybe I can replicate the experience for you:

TDOA:
You're wrong. There, I've proved you're wrong on everything, plus there's a list of people that agree with me from the Creation Institute/AIG and because they have advanced degrees, their opinion automatically trumps the entire scientific community through nothing other than their opinion.

Zen Badger:
ASC states that clocks are set differently as to allow people on the ground to think that their messages are recieved in half the time and sent out back to earth at 300k km/sec and this allows the machine probes to adjust their telemetry on time despite recieving the changes in half the time its creators expected.
It makes perfect sense if you read that untested and non-empirically evidenced paper written by someone who explicity wants to prove the earth and universe is several million times younger than it actually is, becuase he's just trying to find the truth.

Thor:
How dare you compare me to diarrhea! My god says to love and cherish one another when he's not ruthlessly murdering unbelievers and those outside (and inside) of my christian denomination for not being christians of my exact denomination, which is his right because he's not human and we all deserve it for something we never did that happened well before we were individually created by god and sent to earth.
This means that human life is valuable and god is a loving god for not murdering us harder than he already does!

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Oh Come on TDOA, I thought you were above this kind of childish stuff, was I wrong? I have just been super busy, and have not even had a chance to read any of the longer replies.

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I believe that's the record for most hide tags used in a post.

And breathtakingly stooopid arguments?

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Figured you were above the baseless assertion game, until I read this.

[Watson]

...So this guy, let's call him Adam, he goes out one night and he tells his friend he's gambling at a local casino, and that he'll be back. His friend stops him and says, 'But Adam, don't you know that game's crooked there?" And Adam says "Yeah, but it's the only game in town." and goes anyway.

There. There's my contribution to the Evolution vs. Creationism debate...if it can even be called on.

[TheDarkestOfAngels]

Oh Come on TDOA, I thought you were above this kind of childish stuff, was I wrong? I have just been super busy, and have not even had a chance to read any of the longer replies.

Oh, I only posted that in light-hearted jest by poking a little fun at you.
I apoligize if you didn't think it was funny, as my brand of humor can be hit or miss, but I didn't mean anything by it.

By all means, take your time. I'm not rushing you. I'm probably looking at a long absence myself before too long as I may be moving out of state sometime within this or next month. Also - dealing with taxes and other projects I've held off a little too long and hopefully a new job.

[Dotard]

I'm sure he's busy with something.
Here, maybe I can replicate the experience for you:

Me too:


"My Bible states differently and I'll believe that before I believe you."

[Zen Badger]

---

I'm sure he's busy with something.
Here, maybe I can replicate the experience for you:

TDOA:
You're wrong. There, I've proved you're wrong on everything, plus there's a list of people that agree with me from the Creation Institute/AIG and because they have advanced degrees, their opinion automatically trumps the entire scientific community through nothing other than their opinion.

Zen Badger:
ASC states that clocks are set differently as to allow people on the ground to think that their messages are recieved in half the time and sent out back to earth at 300k km/sec and this allows the machine probes to adjust their telemetry on time despite recieving the changes in half the time its creators expected.
It makes perfect sense if you read that untested and non-empirically evidenced paper written by someone who explicity wants to prove the earth and universe is several million times younger than it actually is, becuase he's just trying to find the truth.

Thor:
How dare you compare me to diarrhea! My god says to love and cherish one another when he's not ruthlessly murdering unbelievers and those outside (and inside) of my christian denomination for not being christians of my exact denomination, which is his right because he's not human and we all deserve it for something we never did that happened well before we were individually created by god and sent to earth.
This means that human life is valuable and god is a loving god for not murdering us harder than he already does!

---

Oh Come on TDOA, I thought you were above this kind of childish stuff, was I wrong? I have just been super busy, and have not even had a chance to read any of the longer replies.

---

---

I believe that's the record for most hide tags used in a post.

And breathtakingly stooopid arguments?

---

Figured you were above the baseless assertion game, until I read this.

Hello Waldorf, you were gone so long I was beginning to think you'd been raptured or something.

Been able to reconcile ASC with the neccesity for c to be a constant in order for E=mc2 to work?

And since E=mc2 seems to work so well...........

[Statler Waldorf]

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Oh Come on TDOA, I thought you were above this kind of childish stuff, was I wrong? I have just been super busy, and have not even had a chance to read any of the longer replies.

Oh, I only posted that in light-hearted jest by poking a little fun at you.
I apoligize if you didn't think it was funny, as my brand of humor can be hit or miss, but I didn't mean anything by it.

By all means, take your time. I'm not rushing you. I'm probably looking at a long absence myself before too long as I may be moving out of state sometime within this or next month. Also - dealing with taxes and other projects I've held off a little too long and hopefully a new job.

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No worries mate. I don't mind a little light hearted fun, even at my own expense. What state do you live in and what one are you moving to? I've only been able to get on here about 15 mins at a time, so it will be a bit before I can produce a reply of any length.

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Hello Waldorf, you were gone so long I was beginning to think you'd been raptured or something.

Been able to reconcile ASC with the neccesity for c to be a constant in order for E=mc2 to work?

And since E=mc2 seems to work so well...........

---

Hey Zen,

Well I don't believe in a secret rapture, so... :-)

To be honest I am getting a bit bored with the whole ASC discussion (Astronomy does not interest me nearly as much as Biology, Logic, Apologetics, Movies, Guitar, Girls, Heavy Metal Music, Politics and Theology), but I will answer your question anyways. Well in E=mc^2, "c" is the average speed of light in a vacuum, since we can only measure this in a round trip we do not need to invoke a synchrony convention, so the value for "c" is the same regardless of which synchrony convention is used. Does that make sense?

[Zen Badger]

Hey Zen,

To be honest I am getting a bit bored with the whole ASC discussion

I'm sure you are since it has been quite thoroughly gutted on this thread, however I'm not.

You advanced this rather silly theory as an answer to the problem of the size of the observable universe flatly contradicting the YEC position, I will show WHY ASC doesn't provide an answer.

but I will answer your question anyways. Well in E=mc^2, "c" is the average speed of light in a vacuum, since we can only measure this in a round trip we do not need to invoke a synchrony convention, so the value for "c" is the same regardless of which synchrony convention is used. Does that make sense?

But this is where you fail, E=mc2 requires that c is a constant. Not an average, not able to wildly vary from 1/2 cto infinity.

Because if it wasn't a constant nuclear physicists would not be able to accurately calculate the output of nuclear weapons and reactors..amongst other things.

And it is this one little fact that consigns ASC to the rubbish bin of half assed ideas( such as Lysenkoism) where it belongs.

And since you failed to realise the implications of what ACS means to physics in general I have to admit to serious misgivings as to your actual scientific competence.

[Statler Waldorf]

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Hey Zen,

To be honest I am getting a bit bored with the whole ASC discussion

I'm sure you are since it has been quite thoroughly gutted on this thread, however I'm not.

You advanced this rather silly theory as an answer to the problem of the size of the observable universe flatly contradicting the YEC position, I will show WHY ASC doesn't provide an answer.

but I will answer your question anyways. Well in E=mc^2, "c" is the average speed of light in a vacuum, since we can only measure this in a round trip we do not need to invoke a synchrony convention, so the value for "c" is the same regardless of which synchrony convention is used. Does that make sense?

But this is where you fail, E=mc2 requires that c is a constant. Not an average, not able to wildly vary from 1/2 cto infinity.

Because if it wasn't a constant nuclear physicists would not be able to accurately calculate the output of nuclear weapons and reactors..amongst other things.

And it is this one little fact that consigns ASC to the rubbish bin of half assed ideas( such as Lysenkoism) where it belongs.

And since you failed to realise the implications of what ACS means to physics in general I have to admit to serious misgivings as to your actual scientific competence.

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Well so much for being cordial eh? That's too bad; I was kind of starting to like you Zen. I am actually getting bored with the topic because nobody on here even understands it (I think because they have not read the actual article but rather articles written by others who don't understand it). So it's not unlike trying to debate the greatest quarterback of all time with a bunch of people who don't know what a football is.
Your argument is just fundamentally flawed, it would be like saying, "light can't move at different rates through different substances because that would violate "c" as being a constant!" C is a constant because it is the average speed at which light moves in a vacuum in a round trip. Like I said, you don't even need to use synchrony convention to measure the value of "c", so why you would try and use this to argue against different conventions is beyond me. I suggest you actually read the articles on ASC because every single issue that has been raised against it is addressed in the actual literature. As to your point about Nuclear Physicists, their observations would be exactly the same under the ASC as they are under the ESC because the linear term in the time-dilation formula is not negligible under ASC like it is under ESC. This means we make the same observations under both conventions, just for different reasons, this is why they are called conventions and not theories. However, questioning my science credentials goes to show just how misinformed you really are.