Hubble's Law in the Quran long before Hubble's own discovery

[Brian37]

I agree that religions borrow or steal motifs from prior religions, but no, it does not NOT "confirm" "Plank Time" or "expanding space" or the "Big Bang" anymore than the ancient Greek's use of the word "atom" confirmed quarks, or electrons or protons or neutrons. 

All that ancient squiggle confirms is people guessed and made those bad guesses on prior polytheism whom, those polytheist were as ignorant of modern science as monotheists.

POINT IS, that nobody, worldwide had any clue of what we know today.

Sir I'll have you know Ancient Pastafarianeese is not squiggle; Like Latin, Esperanto and Donald Trumps tweets, It is a language very few can read and understand.

Ok I gotcha now. 

[WinterHold]

I wonder if a moderator can move this to the humor subform.  Pretty sure Atlas is just pulling our chains.  Good one, Atlas.

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The verse says:




Things "break" when they are "expanded"?

How did Mohammed know that heaven was expanding?
If we assumed ignorance and lying of the author of the Quran; why would they refer explicitly to such a fact?
Even a nomad Muslim in the desert 1400 years ago, would know that the skies (universe) is expanding. Not just that; actually saying otherwise defies the verse above.
The universe is expanding, by the direct statement of verse 47 of Sura 51 in the Quran, and the implicit referring by verse 5 of Sura 42

Long before Hubble's discovery. 1400 years approximately.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubble%27s_law


The verse in Arabic:

والسماء بنيناها بأيد وإنا لموسعون

That's a phony translation, which makes the whole thing is phony because the word "manager" didn't exist until 1580 A.D.  https://www.etymonline.com/word/manager

"وكيل" is an ancient word.
It means manager-responsible for

Replace "manager" with "responsible for".
In modern language it's a synonym, in ancient it is the same.

From there, the ancient phrase that most Arabs and Muslims use today:

"Besm Allah Tawakalto 3ala Allah"
"بسم الله توكلت على الله"

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Could you elaborate Wyrd? I don't follow. Couldn't there have been a word that meant the same thing in Arabic?

وكيل=manager/Responsible for" is ancient.

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Snipped gibberish

Once again wrong. Your book shamelessly took the teaching of the first Sumerian Collander scrolls.



"This is from the great epic known as gemellimesh; Translated reads;   'The skies doth expand forever farther than we can ever reach.  It doth expand from a point so small the eye cannot see, smaller than a single grain within a plank of wood. Search the skies my students with not just your eyes but your minds."

This was written somewhere between 2030 and 2056 BCE and it confirmes the following;  Plank time, Expanding space, and the big bang.

Sorry your late to the party Atlas.

RAmen.

Nothing expands forever. Even in the modern theory; the expansion has a stop.
I believe that is when judgement day will come.

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I agree that religions borrow or steal motifs from prior religions, but no, it does not NOT "confirm" "Plank Time" or "expanding space" or the "Big Bang" anymore than the ancient Greek's use of the word "atom" confirmed quarks, or electrons or protons or neutrons. 

All that ancient squiggle confirms is people guessed and made those bad guesses on prior polytheism whom, those polytheist were as ignorant of modern science as monotheists.

POINT IS, that nobody, worldwide had any clue of what we know today.

Sir I'll have you know Ancient Pastafarianeese is not squiggle; Like Latin, Esperanto and Donald Trumps tweets, It is a language very few can read and understand.

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the teaching of the first Sumerian Collander scrolls.

Wait.  I thought the Collander Scrolls were written by the FSM?

Ha.................................................................Ha

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Could you elaborate Wyrd? I don't follow. Couldn't there have been a word that meant the same thing in Arabic?

Some translations use the word "guardian" instead of "manager".  They are not exactly synonyms.  http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/guardian?s=t
[/url]
[url=http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/manager]http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/manager

It might seem to be nitpicky but when newer words are used it tends to shift the meaning of the original thought.  The word "manager" is from the 1580s. https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=manager.  The word "guardian" is from around 1510  https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=guardian.

I can't read Arabic but if a version of the Koran uses a word that can be translated into either "guardian" or "manager" then that copy of the Koran was written in modern times.  So that could mean that every idea in it has been altered from the original 640 A.D. version.  We know that the Koran had a major alteration when it was put into numbered chapters and verses to mirror the Bible's format.  So even if it's written in the Arabic language it doesn't mean that it is the original version.

It's like reading about Guardian Angels in some versions of the Bible.  That idea is from the 1630s and replaces the idea of the cherub from the late 14th Century.  https://www.etymonline.com/word/Cherub

It's very ancient.
Advocate, Disposer of affairs, manager. All mean the literal same thing.

[Brian37]

Here's a thought.

Instead of scouring your magic book to find bits that can be sort of twisted to retrofit things we already know, how about trying to find what it says about the next big discovery? Something we haven't discovered for ourselves through actual science yet? Wouldn't that be a better use for the thing?

You never know, you might come up with a cure for cancer, or spacewarp physics or something. Pointing at mythology, squinting a bit and saying "ha ha, we found it first but nobody noticed until we knew what to look for" doesn't help very much.

100 years ago, this was "new things" that nobody ever knew.
The scientific community said that space is static up until 1922, and that's the earliest record for such a fact being derived from the equations of general relativity.

1400 years ago, the Quran said that. And instead of having faith, many advocated stories of flying horses mentioned in the Hadith. Look where these people are now.

The Quran is not a manufacturing guide, or a book of cosmology and science. It's a message.
Then again; it spoke about an afterlife where creation will get repeated. Many laughed at the thought through time, until science found out that it's a real actual possibility.

I think it already said a lot. And already people lost the chance to concentrate on what it says a lot.

Atlass, NO NO NO NO, and just NO.

"Expansion" the way they used it, had an ANCIENT ignorant meaning, just like when the ancient Greeks used the word "atom" it didn't mean the same thing as modern science uses the term now.

AND AGAIN, every religion has apologists whom try to retrofit modern science to old mythology. Scientific method is a tool, not a religion, it is completely religion independent.

[Cyberman]

Congratulations, Atlas, for making your claim unfalsifiable. And that's not a good thing.


Yep. This whole thing is a babyish game of "nuh-uh, I said it first so I win!", hiding behind the pretend shield of authority.

Sorry, but most of us outgrew shit like that when we got out of nappies (diapers, for the USians). It's a message, alright - it says that some people have a lot of catching up to do.

The whole point is showing why I believe in what I quoted and said; and to show my believe criteria that is based on mere logic and authenticity.
I judged, and my judgement was as follows: this is an ancient book, that said clearly that the universe is expanding. If negation of the previous exists; I will gladly take it and even advocate it.

No, the point is for the proponent of the claim - you, in this case - to support such claim as it pertains to actual reality. It is not someone else's job to negate it, even if they can. Burden of proof, remember?

The game is life, not human nature. Actually; if somebody created a brand first, it's a crime by international law for somebody else to claim authorship over the brand.

No, the game is cherry-picking bits from arcane texts and then pretending they revealed scientific discoveries before they were made - despite the fact that it's only because of the discoveries that you are able to cherry-pick in the first place. That's why I challenged you to find the next big scientific discovery before science does. You'll be incredibly famous, as well as potentially saving lives.

Also, gods are subject to and protected by international law?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

It's "Planck time." Not that accuracy is important in this thread.

[Nay_Sayer]

Delete

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the teaching of the first Sumerian Collander scrolls.

Wait.  I thought the Collander Scrolls were written by the FSM?

That was it's plan, Sadly the great lord above all lords FSM suffered a bad case of tennis elbow and had to have humans transcribe his wisdom.

Humans being the failable beings we are goofed it up.

Atlas. You are wrong, Things can expand forever, For example, your ignorance seems limitless.

[Jehanne]

The verse in Arabic:

والسماء بنيناها بأيد وإنا لموسعون

I think that Mohamed was a pedophile who had epilepsy with delusions of grandeur.

[Minimalist]

I can't read Arabic but if a version of the Koran uses a word that can be translated into either "guardian" or "manager" then that copy of the Koran was written in modern times.

You'd think a fucking "angel" would know that going in and plan accordingly.  Of course, that presupposes that you believe there are fucking "angels."

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I can't read Arabic but if a version of the Koran uses a word that can be translated into either "guardian" or "manager" then that copy of the Koran was written in modern times.

You'd think a fucking "angel" would know that going in and plan accordingly.  Of course, that presupposes that you believe there are fucking "angels."

Damn shame a GOD can't produce an unambiguous text that doesn't require guesswork, imagination, deliberate misinformation, and "holy men" to interpret it. But if you replace "GOD" with "some damn jerkoff" it works perfectly fine. Humans are lazy fucks.

[Wyrd of Gawd]

The verse says:

Sura 51, The Quran:
( 47 )   And the heaven We constructed with hands, and indeed, We are expanding.

Sura 42, The Quran:
( 1 )   Ha, Meem.
( 2 )   'Ayn, Seen, Qaf.
( 3 )   Thus has He revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and to those before you - Allah, the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
( 4 )   To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth, and He is the Most High, the Most Great.
( 5 )   The heavens almost break from above them, and the angels exalt [Allah] with praise of their Lord and ask forgiveness for those on earth. Unquestionably, it is Allah who is the Forgiving, the Merciful.
( 6 )   And those who take as allies other than Him - Allah is [yet] Guardian over them; and you, [O Muhammad], are not over them a manager.

Things "break" when they are "expanded"?

How did Mohammed know that heaven was expanding?
If we assumed ignorance and lying of the author of the Quran; why would they refer explicitly to such a fact?
Even a nomad Muslim in the desert 1400 years ago, would know that the skies (universe) is expanding. Not just that; actually saying otherwise defies the verse above.
The universe is expanding, by the direct statement of verse 47 of Sura 51 in the Quran, and the implicit referring by verse 5 of Sura 42

Long before Hubble's discovery. 1400 years approximately.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hubble%27s_law

Hubble's law is considered the first observational basis for the expansion of the universe

The verse in Arabic:

والسماء بنيناها بأيد وإنا لموسعون

It's important to remember human nature when reading ethnocentric Middle Eastern Jewish and Arabian religious fairy tales.  

On a historical front there's zero evidence that an actual Mohammed character as described in the literature existed.  We do know that Uthman formed a committee to write the Koran fairy tale.  At that time Islam was on the move and starting to expand.  So the natural thing to do when writing the doctrine would be to add a bunch of special effects and grand sounding phrases to show how powerful the imaginry deity is.  It would inspire the mob and scare the crap out of the outsiders.  

I suggest that the line about the heaven expanding was actually about the growth of Islam conquering the riffraff in the area and that it didn't have squat to do with outer space.  The heaven was actually the area that Islam (Uthman) controlled.  

Now here we are hundreds of centuries later and nitwits believe in imaginary celestial deities.  Most humans might as well be turnips because they sure as hell don't use their brains.
http://www.guntner.com/FlashGordon/EmptyMind.wav