DNA Proves Existence of a Designer

[Peebothuhlu]

 He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

---

Okay... So where did 'Evil' come from, then?

[TwoKnives99]

Isaiah 45:7 (KJV)

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Isaiah 45:7 (ESV)

I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.

Either way, this verse throws up two problems, if we focus on the KJV translation, it seems to state that God is responsible for moral evil and therefore why should we worship a God that is responsible for evil?. Focusing on the ESV translation, it represents a common scriptural theme - God punishes those who do not worship him or follow his laws, this makes no sense because God is (supposedly) omniscient and therefore should know who would worship him and who won't

Secondly, God gave us free will, so it follows that we can choose whether or not to worship God.

Therefore has God has no right to punish us for not worshipping Him because we're simply exercising our free will and making a choice.

Therefore, this leads to the question - Why should we worship something that gives us free will, then punishes us for using it?

[Amarok]

God does not mislead or deceive.  

And that's what a deceiver would say 

He is perfectly holy and just

Which is what ever evil bastard who has ever lived has said . Evil never believes it's evil .

He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

Using evil is no different then being evil and nope if he created the universe and potential for evil he is the author .

---

God does not mislead or deceive.  

And that's what a deceiver would say 

He is perfectly holy and just

Which is what ever evil bastard who has ever lived has said . Evil never believes it's evil .

He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

Using evil is no different then being evil and nope if he created the universe and potential for evil he is the author .

[The Grand Nudger]

Who gives a shit.....do you see anything up there about how long "god" existed for?  No, no you don't. 

Only an acknowledgement of your own claim that "god" didn't create everything that we see around us.  

You may as well have shouted "SQUIRREL!!!" at the boards, lol.  How useless can you be?  Can't engage in your own "discussion", can't answer a direct question...can't even fuckin read.......

What are you talking about now?  I answered tons of questions in this thread.  I responded to as many as I could.

SQUIRREL!!!

[Bucky Ball]

[quote pid='1892889' dateline='1553014565']
CDF000
 
That's a pretty stupid thing to say.

1. If your deity can be said to be "perfectly holy and just" then there exists a standard of perfection and justice, which of necessity exists APART from him, and which he could not have created. Where did that standard come from ? If he's just perfect because he possesses the attributes he does, and because of what he is, ... then your standard is meaningless. (Euthyphro's Dilemma).  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euthyphro_dilemma

2. The Bible tells you otherwise. I see you don't really :
a. know the Bible much, AND
b. don't believe it.

Isaiah 45:7 King James Version (KJV)
"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."

ז יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה. {פ} 7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.

You're simply wrong.
You deny the Word of God.
Shame on you.

רשע
The word is "evil".

[CDF47]

I form light and create darkness;
    I make well-being and create calamity;
    I am the Lord, who does all these things.

ESV

Blatant version shopping.

If your god is so marvelous, why exactly are there different versions anyway?

Anyway, lets do the version shopping thing

Isiah 45:7

KJ21 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I, the Lord, do all these things.
ASV I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
AMP The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing peace and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things.
AMPC I form the light and create darkness, I make peace [national well-being] and I create [physical] evil (calamity); I am the Lord, Who does all these things.
BRG I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
CSB I form light and create darkness, I make success and create disaster; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
CEB I form light and create darkness, make prosperity and create doom; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
CJB I form light, I create darkness; I make well-being, I create woe; I, Adonai, do all these things.
CEV I create light and darkness, happiness and sorrow. I, the Lord, do all of this.
DARBY forming the light and creating darkness, making peace and creating evil: I, Jehovah, do all these things.
DRA I form the light, and create darkness, I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord that do all these things.
ERV I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause trouble. I, the Lord, do all these things.
ESV I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
ESVUK I form light and create darkness, I make well-being and create calamity, I am the Lord, who does all these things.
EXB I make the light and create the darkness. I bring ·peace [prosperity; wholeness; C Hebrew shalom], and I ·cause [create] ·troubles [disaster; calamity]. I, the Lord, do all these things.
GNV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
GW I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, the Lord, do all these things.
GNT I create both light and darkness; I bring both blessing and disaster. I, the Lord, do all these things.
HCSB I form light and create darkness, I make success and create disaster; I, Yahweh, do all these things.
ICB I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.
ISV “I form light and create darkness, I make goodness and create disaster. I am the Lord, who does all these things.
JUB I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and create evil: I am the LORD that does all this.
KJV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
AKJV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
LEB I form light and I create darkness; I make peace and I create evil; I am Yahweh; I do all these things.
TLB I form the light and make the dark. I send good times and bad. I, Jehovah, am he who does these things.
MEV I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and create calamity; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NOG I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, Yahweh, do all these things.
NABRE I form the light, and create the darkness, I make weal and create woe; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NASB The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the Lord who does all these.
NCV I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.
NET I am the one who forms light and creates darkness; the one who brings about peace and creates calamity. I am the Lord, who accomplishes all these things.
NIRV I cause light to shine. I also create darkness. I bring good times. I also create hard times. I do all these things. I am the Lord.
NIV I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NIVUK I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NKJV I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create calamity; I, the Lord, do all these things.’
NLV I make light and I make darkness. I bring good and I make trouble. I am the Lord Who does all these things.
NLT I create the light and make the darkness. I send good times and bad times. I, the Lord, am the one who does these things.
NRSV I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVA I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVACE I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVCE I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
OJB I form ohr, and create choshech; I make shalom, and create rah; I Hashem worketh all these things.
RSV I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
RSVCE I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
TLV I form light and create darkness. I make shalom and create calamity. I, Adonai, do all these things.
VOICE I form light and create darkness; I make what is good, happy, and healthy, and I create woe. I, the Eternal One, make them one and all.
WEB I form the light, and create darkness. I make peace, and create calamity. I am Yahweh, who does all these things.
WYC forming light, and making darknesses, making peace, and forming evil; I am the Lord, doing all these things.
YLT Forming light, and preparing darkness, Making peace, and preparing evil, I [am] Jehovah, doing all these things.'

Interesting, isn't it. Almost as if god's word were subject to men's will. Almost as if it were entirely made up.

Also interesting is that "evil" is used in the oldest texts but gets progressively watered down as the superstitious try to shoehorn their god into what they want him to be as opposed to what he really is.

Besides, you can add more clear statements from other parts of the vile tome.

Behold, I will bring evil upon the house of Jeroboam, and will cut off from Jeroboam him that pisseth against the wall. 1 Kings 14:10

Behold, this evil is of the Lord. 2 Kings 6:33

What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? Job 2:10

Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good? Lamententations 3:38

Shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it? Amos 3:6

See CDF, your bible not only makes it clear that your god created evil, it's proud of it. And so are you.

That is why you struggled to condemn slavery as immoral, for example. You have rejected simple human decency and honesty for a magic book which instructs you to accept immoral things which you would not yourself agree with. I put it to you several times that I believe that "there is no time, place or circumstance under which slavery is moral". Wow did you try to wriggle and squirm out of that. The upshot is that you could not bring yourself to agree with that statement. Sure, you jumped through all the well worn hoops. "indentured servitude" (still immoral). "those were the times" (still immoral). "god's ways are not our ways" (still immoral). And so forth.

I could call you many names, but I wont. Somewhere under that thin veneer of religiosity is a real person trying to escape from the slavery of the magic book. I hope that person gets there and finds freedom. Whoever he is, I will shake his hand gladly.

Sadly, there is little hope such a thing will ever happen.

Evil came about by the rebellion of Satan.  

I said there was slavery at the time and the Lord added regulation to it.  The masters were to be righteous and treat the slaves properly.

The Bible prophecies have come true.  There is historical evidence for the Bible.  Science shows there is a Creator with DNA and universe fine-tuning.  This is the truth.  The Lord exists.

---

God does not mislead or deceive.  He is perfectly holy and just.  He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

So ... god didn't create everything, is what you're effectively saying.

He created everything but He allowed free will choices.  The devil rebelled and humans disobeyed.

---

 He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

---

Okay... So where did 'Evil' come from, then?

The free will pride of the devil and his gathering of followers in rebellion.

---

Isaiah 45:7 (KJV)

I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Isaiah 45:7 (ESV)

I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.

Either way, this verse throws up two problems, if we focus on the KJV translation, it seems to state that God is responsible for moral evil and therefore why should we worship a God that is responsible for evil?. Focusing on the ESV translation, it represents a common scriptural theme - God punishes those who do not worship him or follow his laws, this makes no sense because God is (supposedly) omniscient and therefore should know who would worship him and who won't

Secondly, God gave us free will, so it follows that we can choose whether or not to worship God.

Therefore has God has no right to punish us for not worshipping Him because we're simply exercising our free will and making a choice.

Therefore, this leads to the question - Why should we worship something that gives us free will, then punishes us for using it?

You choose good or evil.  That is the only option.  Accepting Jesus as your savior and repenting your sins are the way to the Father.

---

God does not mislead or deceive.  

And that's what a deceiver would say 

He is perfectly holy and just

Which is what ever evil bastard who has ever lived has said . Evil never believes it's evil .

He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

Using evil is no different then being evil and nope if he created the universe and potential for evil he is the author .

---

God does not mislead or deceive.  

And that's what a deceiver would say 

He is perfectly holy and just

Which is what ever evil bastard who has ever lived has said . Evil never believes it's evil .

He can use evil on this earth for His bidding but He is not the author of evil.

Using evil is no different then being evil and nope if he created the universe and potential for evil he is the author .

I disagree.  God is not the author of evil.  Free willed beings that choose evil are evil and the devil is the author of evil.

---

[quote pid='1892889' dateline='1553014565']
CDF000
 
That's a pretty stupid thing to say.

1. If your deity can be said to be "perfectly holy and just" then there exists a standard of perfection and justice, which of necessity exists APART from him, and which he could not have created. Where did that standard come from ? If he's just perfect because he possesses the attributes he does, and because of what he is, ... then your standard is meaningless. (Euthyphro's Dilemma).  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euthyphro_dilemma

2. The Bible tells you otherwise. I see you don't really :
a. know the Bible much, AND
b. don't believe it.

Isaiah 45:7 King James Version (KJV)
"I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."

ז  יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה.  {פ} 7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.

You're simply wrong.
You deny the Word of God.
Shame on you.

רשע
The word is "evil".

[/quote]
The word is calamity.  I went over this before.

[Abaddon_ire]

Blatant version shopping.

If your god is so marvelous, why exactly are there different versions anyway?

Anyway, lets do the version shopping thing

Isiah 45:7

KJ21 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I, the Lord, do all these things.
ASV I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.
AMP The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing peace and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things.
AMPC I form the light and create darkness, I make peace [national well-being] and I create [physical] evil (calamity); I am the Lord, Who does all these things.
BRG I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
CSB I form light and create darkness, I make success and create disaster; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
CEB I form light and create darkness, make prosperity and create doom; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
CJB I form light, I create darkness; I make well-being, I create woe; I, Adonai, do all these things.
CEV I create light and darkness, happiness and sorrow. I, the Lord, do all of this.
DARBY forming the light and creating darkness, making peace and creating evil: I, Jehovah, do all these things.
DRA I form the light, and create darkness, I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord that do all these things.
ERV I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause trouble. I, the Lord, do all these things.
ESV I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.
ESVUK I form light and create darkness, I make well-being and create calamity, I am the Lord, who does all these things.
EXB I make the light and create the darkness. I bring ·peace [prosperity; wholeness; C Hebrew shalom], and I ·cause [create] ·troubles [disaster; calamity]. I, the Lord, do all these things.
GNV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
GW I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, the Lord, do all these things.
GNT I create both light and darkness; I bring both blessing and disaster. I, the Lord, do all these things.
HCSB I form light and create darkness, I make success and create disaster; I, Yahweh, do all these things.
ICB I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.
ISV “I form light and create darkness, I make goodness and create disaster. I am the Lord, who does all these things.
JUB I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and create evil: I am the LORD that does all this.
KJV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
AKJV I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
LEB I form light and I create darkness; I make peace and I create evil; I am Yahweh; I do all these things.
TLB I form the light and make the dark. I send good times and bad. I, Jehovah, am he who does these things.
MEV I form the light and create darkness; I make peace and create calamity; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NOG I make light and create darkness. I make blessings and create disasters. I, Yahweh, do all these things.
NABRE I form the light, and create the darkness, I make weal and create woe; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NASB The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the Lord who does all these.
NCV I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.
NET I am the one who forms light and creates darkness; the one who brings about peace and creates calamity. I am the Lord, who accomplishes all these things.
NIRV I cause light to shine. I also create darkness. I bring good times. I also create hard times. I do all these things. I am the Lord.
NIV I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NIVUK I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.
NKJV I form the light and create darkness, I make peace and create calamity; I, the Lord, do all these things.’
NLV I make light and I make darkness. I bring good and I make trouble. I am the Lord Who does all these things.
NLT I create the light and make the darkness. I send good times and bad times. I, the Lord, am the one who does these things.
NRSV I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVA I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVACE I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
NRSVCE I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe; I the Lord do all these things.
OJB I form ohr, and create choshech; I make shalom, and create rah; I Hashem worketh all these things.
RSV I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
RSVCE I form light and create darkness, I make weal and create woe, I am the Lord, who do all these things.
TLV I form light and create darkness. I make shalom and create calamity. I, Adonai, do all these things.
VOICE I form light and create darkness; I make what is good, happy, and healthy, and I create woe. I, the Eternal One, make them one and all.
WEB I form the light, and create darkness. I make peace, and create calamity. I am Yahweh, who does all these things.
WYC forming light, and making darknesses, making peace, and forming evil; I am the Lord, doing all these things.
YLT Forming light, and preparing darkness, Making peace, and preparing evil, I [am] Jehovah, doing all these things.'

Interesting, isn't it. Almost as if god's word were subject to men's will. Almost as if it were entirely made up.

Also interesting is that "evil" is used in the oldest texts but gets progressively watered down as the superstitious try to shoehorn their god into what they want him to be as opposed to what he really is.

Besides, you can add more clear statements from other parts of the vile tome.

Behold, I will bring evil upon the house of Jeroboam, and will cut off from Jeroboam him that pisseth against the wall. 1 Kings 14:10

Behold, this evil is of the Lord. 2 Kings 6:33

What? shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil? Job 2:10

Out of the mouth of the most High proceedeth not evil and good? Lamententations 3:38

Shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it? Amos 3:6

See CDF, your bible not only makes it clear that your god created evil, it's proud of it. And so are you.

That is why you struggled to condemn slavery as immoral, for example. You have rejected simple human decency and honesty for a magic book which instructs you to accept immoral things which you would not yourself agree with. I put it to you several times that I believe that "there is no time, place or circumstance under which slavery is moral". Wow did you try to wriggle and squirm out of that. The upshot is that you could not bring yourself to agree with that statement. Sure, you jumped through all the well worn hoops. "indentured servitude" (still immoral). "those were the times" (still immoral). "god's ways are not our ways" (still immoral). And so forth.

I could call you many names, but I wont. Somewhere under that thin veneer of religiosity is a real person trying to escape from the slavery of the magic book. I hope that person gets there and finds freedom. Whoever he is, I will shake his hand gladly.

Sadly, there is little hope such a thing will ever happen.

Evil came about by the rebellion of Satan.  

Not according to your magic book.

I said there was slavery at the time and the Lord added regulation to it.  The masters were to be righteous and treat the slaves properly.

Still can't bring yourself to agree that there is no time, place or circumstance. Neither can your god. He could have said "thou shalt not own people as property" but he didn't. Because he is immoral and so are you.

The Bible prophecies have come true.

No.

  There is historical evidence for the Bible.

No

  Science shows there is a Creator with DNA and universe fine-tuning.  This is the truth.  The Lord exists.

No

ז  יוֹצֵר אוֹר וּבוֹרֵא חֹשֶׁךְ, עֹשֶׂה שָׁלוֹם וּבוֹרֵא רָע; אֲנִי יְהוָה, עֹשֶׂה כָל-אֵלֶּה.  {פ} 7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am the LORD, that doeth all these things.

You're simply wrong.
You deny the Word of God.
Shame on you.

רשע
The word is "evil".

The word is calamity.  I went over this before.

Liar
https://www.lingq.com/en/translate/he/%D...%A9%D7%A2/

[TwoKnives99]

Fine, let’s assume that Satan is the author of evil rather than God, if that is the case, since God created Satan and since God is omniscient, God created Satan, fully aware that Satan would become the author of evil, therefore even if God is not the creator of evil, he is responsible for it since he bought Satan into existence, aware that he would become evil. God is responsible because of his inaction.

[CDF47]

Evil came about by the rebellion of Satan.  

Not according to your magic book.

I said there was slavery at the time and the Lord added regulation to it.  The masters were to be righteous and treat the slaves properly.

Still can't bring yourself to agree that there is no time, place or circumstance. Neither can your god. He could have said "thou shalt not own people as property" but he didn't. Because he is immoral and so are you.

The Bible prophecies have come true.

No.

  There is historical evidence for the Bible.

No

  Science shows there is a Creator with DNA and universe fine-tuning.  This is the truth.  The Lord exists.

No

The word is calamity.  I went over this before.

Liar
https://www.lingq.com/en/translate/he/%D...%A9%D7%A2/

He allows evil to run its course before He destroys it.

---

Fine, let’s assume that Satan is the author of evil rather than God, if that is the case, since God created Satan and since God is omniscient, God created Satan, fully aware that Satan would become the author of evil, therefore even if God is not the creator of evil, he is responsible for it since he bought Satan into existence, aware that he would become evil. God is responsible because of his inaction.

Sometimes it appears He steps back to see what will occur like when He let Adam name the animals.

[fredd bear]

Not according to your magic book.

Still can't bring yourself to agree that there is no time, place or circumstance. Neither can your god. He could have said "thou shalt not own people as property" but he didn't. Because he is immoral and so are you.

No.

No

No

Liar
https://www.lingq.com/en/translate/he/%D...%A9%D7%A2/

He allows evil to run its course before He destroys it.

---

Fine, let’s assume that Satan is the author of evil rather than God, if that is the case, since God created Satan and since God is omniscient, God created Satan, fully aware that Satan would become the author of evil, therefore even if God is not the creator of evil, he is responsible for it since he bought Satan into existence, aware that he would become evil. God is responsible because of his inaction.

Sometimes it appears He steps back to see what will occur like when He let Adam name the animals.

(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((9))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

 Well, as it turns out, the bible says god invented evil:

Isaiah 45:7 in the King James Version reads, “I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things

 Prophecy? Well, there is certainly  a lot of truth in some prophecy. By "some"  I mean that which was written after the event . 

The prophecy showing Jesus was the Messiah? No, not really.   This has always been verifiable by actually  reading ALL of the prophecy about the Messiah, rather than cherry picking  the bits which can be made to fit.

The Book of Revelations: A  favourite of the smaller millennial sects, as its vague, demented ramblings can be interpreted in all kinds of interesting ways. The Catholics have always been a bit embarrassed by Revelations, and general pretend it's not there . I've always suspected ergot poisoning.