How Hopeless Is Voting?

[Amarok]

Not really all he's saying that one could argue against democracy by pointing to voters .

That was the argument the Founding Fathers used for creating a republic.  Imagine how horrified they'd be if they came back to see blacks and even <gasp> women voting?

I'm simply pointing out he does not seem to endorsing the later quote . Only someone who is against democracy could .

[chimp3]

Voting is our best shot because violence rarely achieves more than continuing  tyranny. This coming from a person who thinks the best thing my country did was throw off British ties. Reinforced every time there is a British Royal Wedding!

[The Industrial Atheist]

I think in the US it's rarely completely hopeless. In a place that's full oligarchy instead of half to three quarters it probably could be.

[Minimalist]

That was the argument the Founding Fathers used for creating a republic.  Imagine how horrified they'd be if they came back to see blacks and even <gasp> women voting?

I'm simply pointing out he does not seem to endorsing the later quote . Only someone who is against democracy could .

Churchill had a habit of changing parties as the need arose.  Perhaps he forgot all his comments when he changed sides?

[Amarok]

I'm simply pointing out he does not seem to endorsing the later quote . Only someone who is against democracy could .

Churchill had a habit of changing parties as the need arose.  Perhaps he forgot all his comments when he changed sides?

Pretty sure h did not

[Minimalist]

He had his flaws.

https://www.smh.com.au/opinion/the-dark-...35h71.html

But there's another side to Churchill's politics and career that should not be forgot amid the endless parade of eulogies. To many outside the West, he remains an unvarnished racist and a stubborn imperialist, forever on the wrong side of history.
Churchill's detractors point to his well-documented bigotry, articulated often with shocking callousness and contempt. "I hate Indians," he once trumpeted. "They are a beastly people with a beastly religion."
He referred to Palestinians as "barbaric hordes who ate little but camel dung". When quashing insurgents in Sudan in the earlier days of his imperial career, Churchill boasted of killing three "savages". Contemplating restive populations in northwest Asia, he infamously lamented the "squeamishness" of his colleagues, who were not in "favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes".

There were times when he was almost Trumply.... except Trump never did go near where there were bullets flying.

[Anomalocaris]

How hopeless is voting? Can we vote our way to freedom?

Isn’t the point of voting to give up the freedom to act as you would have had you won the vote when you’ve lost the vote?

[Edwardo Piet]

Churchill was quite a hypocrite, though.

Those don't contradict.

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How hopeless is voting? Can we vote our way to freedom?

Isn’t the point of voting to give up the freedom to act as you would have had you won the vote when you’ve lost the vote?

No that isn't the point of it at all. I act exactly the same in both cases.

Take Brexit for example. Before Brexit I said it was stupid. And after Brexit it I said it was stupid just as much as I would have if Brexit had lost.

And in the UK I think the conservatives are stupid whether they win or lose.

[CapnAwesome]

Not really all he's saying that one could argue against democracy by pointing to voters .

That was the argument the Founding Fathers used for creating a republic.  Imagine how horrified they'd be if they came back to see blacks and even <gasp> women voting?

Some wouldn't be horrified at all. Benjamin Franklin in the latter part of his life believes Blacks to be the intellectual equals of whites And supported abolition. And considering that women in New Jersey were allowed to vote from 1776 to 1800 I doubt they'd be totally surprised by either.

[Alan V]

Choosing between two lesser evils and having the option to choose the lesser evil definitely doesn't mean that voting doesn't work because a lesser evil is better than a greater evil.

The idea that there can ever be a perfect anything is a holdover from theistic assumptions.  The real world always involves trade-offs because the real world wasn't designed for us.

In other words, humans deserve more credit than they usually get.