Illegal Immigration

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Thousands sneak in every day? I wonder how accurate that is

Estimates say about 400,000 tried in 2018 (fact check.org) so a bit over one thousand a day.

The claim was that 'thousands sneak in every day'.  The datum from factcheck is apprehensions.  Not the same thing.

Boru

[Brian37]

Estimates say about 400,000 tried in 2018 (fact check.org) so a bit over one thousand a day.

The claim was that 'thousands sneak in every day'.  The datum from factcheck is apprehensions.  Not the same thing.

Boru

Forget numbers, most are non violent in any case. If I had my choice of letting in 999 non violent individuals or deporting one violent person born here with legal status, I know who I would forgive for lack of paperwork, and whom I would kick out for acts of violence. 

Point is, immigration policy should not be based on fear or bigotry, no matter how someone gets in. It should be based on actions, and if the person is violent or non violent, give priority to non violent individuals, regardless of papers, and focus on kicking out violent individuals.

[Mister Agenda]

The question is simple-- does the US have enough people, or would it like to have more people? I think it has enough people. Therefore, it should invite those who fill roles which are under-represented.

We are a vast country with a low average population density. With its aging population and reproduction below replacement, the USA absolutely needs more people to sustain its long-term tax base and labor needs. The Hispanic immigrants we allow in now will produce the generation that we need to be in place when all the Baby Boomers are over 70.

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There are many unemployed people, and yet most of them don't want these jobs.  Are they lazy?

You can offer $20 an hour to be a ranch hand or $12 to pick watermelons, and still won't be able to meet your labor needs if you exclude migrants. There just aren't enough non-Hispanic American citizens familiar enough with that kind of work and able to perform the heavy labor involved to meet the needs of farmers. When you do get a non-Hispanic citizen for the job, most of the time they can't do it well enough to justify paying them even $10 an your.

Peach-picking in Georgia typically pays $12 an hour. When they clamped down on illegal immigrants, the peaches were rotting off the trees, because they couldn't get enough workers to bring in the harvest. This kind of crop loss associated with 'getting tough on illegals' has been repeated multiple times.

If the laws on the books require us to shoot ourselves in the foot, maybe they're bad laws. And if we can't change them through normal processes, maybe they're being kept the way they are for irrational reasons, like nativism.

[Pat Mustard]

The natives are below the pop replacement rate.  It's not an issue of whether or not we'd like* more people  We simply have to have them.  Immigration is inextricably linked to our gdp.  We have two choices.  Fuck a whole lot more and have a few million more kids, yearly...or shrink.

It's the way of the western world. You get rich enough, comfortable enough and the reproduction rate plummets.

[Brian37]

The natives are below the pop replacement rate.  It's not an issue of whether or not we'd like* more people  We simply have to have them.  Immigration is inextricably linked to our gdp.  We have two choices.  Fuck a whole lot more and have a few million more kids, yearly...or shrink.

It's the way of the western world.  You get rich enough, comfortable enough and the reproduction rate plummets.

Um no, I don't think birth rates are based on wealth. I think lower birth rates are based on education and societal stability.

Gadaffi was a billionaire but I am quite sure the population he bullied, while for a while he provided for, had/has the same religious views our right wingers do as far as females and reproduction.

Saudi Arabia is a rich nation too. But look how long it took females the right to drive.

There is a huge difference between individuals with money and power, and a entire society.

Polygamy in antiquity was a way for the male head of the household to create status and a way for the family of the donated female to create social connections. Polygamy in antiquity was a status symbol.

[Jane2d]

Job: Tax Prep.
“When Black people commit a crime THEY GET 3 strikes, when illegal aliens commit crimes they get amnesty & benefits”

"illegals get to claim people living in Mexico!  I couldn't claim my people when they was flooded!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7dDOm2NXgk

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 Once upon a time, not so long ago, Schumer (and Feinstein) vote for a fence/barrier along the southern border.  VOTED FOR, not campaigned about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijLJSTGA3hs

[SteelCurtain]

Yes. In 2000, before drone and motion sensor technology was ubiquitous and cost effective.

No one is claiming that we should spend nothing on border security. We're just claiming that there are better, more cost effective methods available than a physical wall. When Schumer and Pelosi talk about it, they all agree that it is a humanitarian crisis. The next sentence, however, disputes the claim that the crisis will be solved by a physical barrier, but rather will intensify it.

The very idea that the humanitarian crisis at the border constitutes a national emergency is ridiculous. If anyone thinks a national emergency is solved by 10+ years of wall construction and tens of billions of dollars in additional cost and maintenance, then I have a beachfront property in Idaho to sell you.

[Yonadav]

The natives are below the pop replacement rate.  It's not an issue of whether or not we'd like* more people  We simply have to have them.  Immigration is inextricably linked to our gdp.  We have two choices.  Fuck a whole lot more and have a few million more kids, yearly...or shrink.

It's the way of the western world.  You get rich enough, comfortable enough and the reproduction rate plummets.

I am way behind on this discussion, but I just read your post. Reproduction drops enormously after a few generations in which most babies born survive to adulthood. Women used to need to have 4 to 6 babies in order to have 2 survive to adulthood. Throughout history, women who were able to survive it had many children. And yet the overall population growth of the world was considerably less than one percent per year. The industrial revolution and soap really changed that. We are sort of hardwired to naturally want two or three surviving children. Given an environment in which babies are surviving to adulthood, we naturally stop having more than two or three children per couple. It takes a few generations for couples to really believe their babies will survive, but then birth rates will drop. 

Here's a TED lecture that says some of this stuff if you are interested.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2LyzBoHo5EI

[Jane2d]

Yes. In 2000, before drone and motion sensor technology was ubiquitous and cost effective.

The letter was 2000. 2006 Chuckie signed the border wall funding. It is an ongoing issue he has supported in the past but suddenly its abhorrent for him. Political grandstanding.

You make claims that are unsubstantiated AND not used in real life anywhere as a primary deterrent. NOPE drone and mot.sen.tech is an addition to traditional security (wall, barrier, checkpoint, etc).

Humanitarian crisis??? lol... This is purely about money. Plenty of newspaper articles out there talking to the actual illegals (caravan or not). Over and over its "cuz we are poor, there is no money".

They turned down mexico's offer of asylum. Fuck 'em; fill out the right paperwork or get used to being told no. There are plenty of methods for them to LEGALLY immigrate.

[Yonadav]

Yes. In 2000, before drone and motion sensor technology was ubiquitous and cost effective.

The letter was 2000.  2006 Chuckie signed the border wall funding.  It is an ongoing issue he has supported in the past but suddenly its abhorrent for him. Political grandstanding.  

You make claims that are unsubstantiated AND not used in real life anywhere as a primary deterrent.  NOPE drone and mot.sen.tech is an addition to traditional security (wall, barrier, checkpoint, etc).

Humanitarian crisis??? lol...  This is purely about money.  Plenty of newspaper articles out there talking to the actual illegals (caravan or not).  Over and over its "cuz we are poor, there is no money".  

They turned down mexico's offer of asylum.  Fuck 'em; fill out the right paperwork or get used to being told no.  There are plenty of methods for them to LEGALLY immigrate.

I did not know that Mexico offered them asylum. My understanding was that they were only offered the right to apply for asylum in Mexico (which isn't really an offer since Mexico has to allow them to apply for asylum). And can you tell me more about the many methods that there are for them to legally immigrate?