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What do you think about aliens?
#41
RE: What do you think about aliens?
(May 3, 2019 at 8:27 am)ignoramus Wrote: Guys, being in Australia, I don't hear much of your local stuff.
Can you guys shed some light on this.

It's obviously bs otherwise it should be front page news. But it's not. Please explain.




Faux Noise. The same group who still think Trump is a good president.
Dying to live, living to die.
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#42
RE: What do you think about aliens?
(May 3, 2019 at 1:12 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: Actually, no, and no.

Global background war casualties rate during time of no major war (like WWII, WWI, Napoleonic war and thirty years war) as measured By war casualties per hundred thousand global population has been higher in the 1945 - 2010 period than any other time since the year 1400.   The increase in wealth in bulk of the third world is but primarily an artifact of the a natural catching of a portion of the world that had historically been the most developed and wealthiest part of the world for three quarter of the last 2000 years.  Parts that were always poor in the last 2000 years either has been completely suppressed by conquest, or remains poor.    Yet Brexit, trump, the disintegration of western alliance and global trade framework foretell even such institutions and outlooks as have prevented the last 70 years from being even worse is unraveling.

thats called pessimistic view on facts. think globally. We evolve you like it or not.

The Absolute Number of War Deaths is Declining since 1945. The absolute number of war deaths has been declining since 1946
https://ourworldindata.org/war-and-peace

"Compared to prehistoric, pre-state, and even Medieval man, Harvard psychology professor Steven Pinker argues, the world has become incredibly peaceful. "Violence has been in decline for thousands of years," Pinker said in the Wall Street Journal, "and today we may be living in the most peaceable era in the existence of our species.""

Also american housewives didn't store japanese soldiers skulls as a gift from warzone in their housesSmile. Something happen in human mind , reson why (devastating war, overall evolution of tech progress that makes human life easy) since 1946's we become a lot smarter and pacifistic.

also i don't believe in space ships visiting our earth. most of it just natural weather phenomena. Imagine high tech smart aliens whp travel billions of miles through space -just wanna cheap redneck thrills to scare people with their ships. lol
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#43
RE: What do you think about aliens?
You use the expression “we evolve [whether] you like it or not” as if that is an somehow overpowering assertion leading inevitably to where you, for purely subjective reasons, wish we as a specie are going.

But your confidence in evolution having a predictable end point and that end point must somehow be pleasing to you makes it clear you have no idea what evolution really is, so your using it as a assertion in support of your conclusion merely makes it clear how flaccidly and sloppily you drew your conclusions.

We are most definitely evolving.  But the only reason for it is there can be no form of existence involving genes and biological reproduction that does not involve the process of evolving.   If not all members of our species all succeed to the exact equal degree in reproducing purely by parthenogenesis, then we are evolving.    We evolve simply and totally because each of our genes are slightly different, we are driven to reproduce, there are reasons why not all of us succeed to the same degree, and we are not yet extinct.   That’s all.

But evolution is not an goal directed activity.   Evolving doesn’t mean getter better by any subjective criteria, such as more peaceful, or more high minded, or nicer to each other. Evolving doesn’t even mean becoming better adapted to our environment of the future.  It only means composition of our gene pool reacted in a very deep and complex, and not cosmetically driven or ideologically pleasing way, to the environment of its own past.  We were evolving when we went from being less cannibalistic to being more cannibalistic.  We were also evolving when we went from being more cannibalistic to being less cannibalistic.  We were evolving when we killed eeachother less often and more reluctantly, and we were evolving when we killed eeachother more often and ore lustily.

This is not pessimistic, nor optimistic, any more than saying protons have positive change is either optimistic or pessimistic.  This is reality at a level more fundamental than we have the power to affect.
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#44
RE: What do you think about aliens?
At work.

Here's some musings.

The time it takes to travers stellar distances (Even with something as exotic as an Alcubierre drive) will take years both 'Ship' and 'Planet' time.

Now..... think about the great ocean voyages of discovery.

Colonies were grown from parent cultures that, in part due to the tyranny of distance, changed and seperated from said progenitors.

Should we cast ourselves outward (As in Arthur C Clark's "Songs of a distant earth") then similar changes, both cultural and genetic, will happen.

So..... in time we may, indeed, cross paths with 'Aliens' and they will be us.

Cheers.
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#45
RE: What do you think about aliens?
I think it will take us much longer to reach the technological sophistication and economic scale to be able to emigrate and colonize via actual interstellar travel of the colonists than it will take us to reach the level where we master the human biology to the point where we can modify or create human beings arbitrarily.

So I suspect the stage in our development where large number of humans mostly like we who are on the planet earth now emigrate on interstellar journeys much as Europeans and Africans emigrated to American in 15-20th century will never occur.

We will modify our biology and means of reproduction so that those of us on earth will not find emigration the only way out.

To the extent we feel the urge to explore or acquire resource robotic probe, perhaps manufactured with conscious machine intelligence, will take the place of live human explorers.

To the extent we feel the need to spread our wild oats to other star systems to avoid being taken out by any cataclysm afflicting our solar system, our ability to manufacture humans will make it a waste to actually move live humans via emigration.   It would be far easier and cheaper to send robotic probes to potential habitable planets that will than manufacture new humans in situ to populate the planets after arrival.

Only forcible escape could motivate some small number to attempt to actually emigrate.   Most of our expansion will be done by robotics that would be preprogrammed to manufacture new and customer designed biological or cybernetic human descendants when robots arrive at the new and suitably prepared colonization sites.
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#46
RE: What do you think about aliens?
I don't think we know enough to call it one way or the other.
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#47
RE: What do you think about aliens?
If in fact brute colonization via interstellar emigration is not a major step in the development of interstellar civilization, then that means the cost of interstellar expansion would be much lower than we imagined. It also means the incentive to forcibly convert somewhat unsuitable candidate systems for expansion would be much less because the value of keeping expansion in a compact consolidated mass would be less. This could provide a explanation for why even if we are surrounded by interstellar civilizations, they may have no reason to comport themselves in ways that would reveal themselves to us.
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#48
RE: What do you think about aliens?
(May 4, 2019 at 11:57 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: If in fact brute colonization via interstellar emigration is not a major step in the development of interstellar civilization, then that means the cost of interstellar expansion would be much lower than we imagined. It also means the incentive to forcibly convert somewhat unsuitable candidate systems for expansion would be much less because the value of keeping expansion in a compact consolidated mass would be less. This could provide a explanation for why even if we are surrounded by interstellar civilizations, they may have no reason to comport themselves in ways that would reveal themselves to us.

But what if they need to build a hyperspace bypass?

Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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#49
RE: What do you think about aliens?
(May 4, 2019 at 11:57 am)Anomalocaris Wrote: If in fact brute colonization via interstellar emigration is not a major step in the development of interstellar civilization, then that means the cost of interstellar expansion would be much lower than we imagined. It also means the incentive to forcibly convert somewhat unsuitable candidate systems for expansion would be much less because the value of keeping expansion in a compact consolidated mass would be less. This could provide a explanation for why even if we are surrounded by interstellar civilizations, they may have no reason to comport themselves in ways that would reveal themselves to us.

Or they're Moties.
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#50
RE: What do you think about aliens?
Given the current knowledge of exoplanets I'd rather say that alien life in general does exist. Speaking of intelligent life (as we understand it) and space-faring civilizations, I have no firm opinion. No signs of them have been traced so far after all. Maybe such civilizations are very scarce. Maybe they do not furvive long enaugh according to a well-known hypothesis. Maybe they are not interested in contact. One can only guess.
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