Our server costs ~$56 per month to run. Please consider donating or becoming a Patron to help keep the site running. Help us gain new members by following us on Twitter and liking our page on Facebook!
Current time: March 29, 2024, 5:10 am

Thread Rating:
  • 0 Vote(s) - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order
#81
RE: In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order
Earlier in the thread I mentioned that, to me, the boundaries between objective and subjective are blurred to begin with. However, even if we set up discreet and absolute boundaries, it also seems to me that both have an intimate relationship with one another. That is to say, that the contents of each often references or overlaps with the contents of the other.

In terms of overlap you have things such as sounds, in which the subjective experience of loudness corresponds to the objective observation of amplitude.

In terms of reference, you have subjective opinions such as personal views on abortion, which clearly reference the external acts of abortion.

When I see individuals in this thread saying morality is subjective and others objective, it makes me wonder if both are saying that morality is exclusively subjective or exclusively objective without any referent or overlap into the other category.

Thoughts?
Reply
#82
RE: In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order
(August 29, 2019 at 12:46 pm)John 6IX Breezy Wrote: When I see individuals in this thread saying morality is subjective and others objective, it makes me wonder if both are saying that morality is exclusively subjective or exclusively objective without any referent or overlap into the other category.

Thoughts?

It depends on the type of overlap you're referring to.

Those like myself who subscribe to a view of Good as property of some non-natural reality, like Platos Form for the Good, mean this exists exclusively objective, like the Sun, or the table in my room.

But like that nature of all such truths, we perceive it subjectively, like my perception of the sun is subjective, meaning I perceive it through my head, and discerns it's independence (objective existence) through my mind.

Others seem to smuggle the objectiveness of good and bad, into the objectiveness of the scientific and historic facts surrounding x. A position I find false. I acknowledge the objectiveness of good and bad, but we won't find in the scientific and historic facts about x .
Reply
#83
RE: In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order
The sun and the table exist in the way of natural objects. Circles exist in the way of non natural objects.

Here again you make it clear that you are referencing the supernatural. Not the non natural.

This is a massive fuckup, what with the one literally called non-the other.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
#84
RE: In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order
(August 29, 2019 at 12:46 pm)John 6IX Breezy Wrote: ...
When I see individuals in this thread saying morality is subjective and others objective, it makes me wonder if both are saying that morality is exclusively subjective or exclusively objective without any referent or overlap into the other category.

Thoughts?

I wonder that too.

But more than that, I can't fathom why either term has any relevance in the context of morality. It just seems so 18th century.

Smile
The PURPOSE of life is to replicate our DNA ................. (from Darwin)
The MEANING of life is the experience of living ... (from Frank Herbert)
The VALUE of life is the legacy we leave behind ..... (from observation)
Reply
#85
RE: In Defense of a Non-Natural Moral Order
(August 30, 2019 at 2:58 pm)DLJ Wrote:
(August 29, 2019 at 12:46 pm)John 6IX Breezy Wrote: ...
When I see individuals in this thread saying morality is subjective and others objective, it makes me wonder if both are saying that morality is exclusively subjective or exclusively objective without any referent or overlap into the other category.

Thoughts?

I wonder that too.

But more than that, I can't fathom why either term has any relevance in the context of morality. It just seems so 18th century.

Smile

We could be using those ridiculous hats.
Reply



Possibly Related Threads...
Thread Author Replies Views Last Post
  Does the fact that many non-human animals have pituitary disprove Cartesian Dualism? FlatAssembler 36 1988 June 23, 2023 at 9:36 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Relationship between programming languages and natural languages FlatAssembler 13 1112 June 12, 2023 at 9:39 pm
Last Post: The Valkyrie
  Maximizing Moral Virtue h311inac311 191 12784 December 17, 2022 at 10:36 pm
Last Post: Objectivist
  Does a natural "god" maybe exist? Skeptic201 19 1643 November 27, 2022 at 7:46 am
Last Post: BrianSoddingBoru4
  As a nonreligious person, where do you get your moral guidance? Gentle_Idiot 79 6403 November 26, 2022 at 10:27 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Moral justification for the execution of criminals of war? Macoleco 184 6575 August 19, 2022 at 7:03 pm
Last Post: bennyboy
  On theism, why do humans have moral duties even if there are objective moral values? Pnerd 37 3089 May 24, 2022 at 11:49 am
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Metaethics Part 1: Cognitivism/Non-cognitivism Disagreeable 24 1461 February 11, 2022 at 6:46 pm
Last Post: The Grand Nudger
  Can we trust our Moral Intuitions? vulcanlogician 72 3616 November 7, 2021 at 1:25 pm
Last Post: Alan V
  Any Moral Relativists in the House? vulcanlogician 72 4587 June 21, 2021 at 9:09 am
Last Post: vulcanlogician



Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)