The Irishman

[The Grand Nudger]

Sheerans contention was that it was his participation in WW2 that accounted for his later aptitude and involvement in organized crime. His recollection of "the good old days" was that it was essentially a string of warcrimes.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Then there's the title: "The Irishman"

Imagine if somebody made a film with that title about an amoral multi multi murderous piece of shit but was NOT accompanied by a cheery "good old days" soundtrack and many reassurances that he's basically a decent, respectful, honourable guy ala Scorcese treatment?

The anti-racism brigade would have a field day, especially in the age of wokeness - it'd never make it past the censors with that title. That is PROOF that the Irishman in question is very far indeed away from being portrayed in anything approaching a wholly negative light.

EgoDeath - I'm a massive fan of the Hellraiser series, Candyman trilogy and the films of David Cronenberg, so really no need to confine myself to the Disney Channel.

Well, it’s a period piece, so that pretty neatly disposes of your point about the soundtrack.

Exactly what in the depiction of Frank Sheeran leads you to think he’s being portrayed as decent, respectful [sic] or honourable?

It’s neither reasonable nor accurate to portray an historic person in a ‘wholly negative light’.

I’m beginning to question whether you’ve actually seen this film.

Boru

[Duty]

I said I've watched it Boru and I have - no need to call me a pork pier. I think I need read up on this Sheeran despot and rewatch the film before I post further on this film they named after his country of origin. Not tonight though...I'm watching "Maps to the Stars" 2014 tonight.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

I said I've watched it Boru and I have - no need to call me a pork pier. I think I need read up on this Sheeran despot and rewatch the film before I post further on this film they named after his country of origin. Not tonight though...I'm watching "Maps to the Stars"  2014 tonight.

If it had been named after his country of origin, it would have been called ‘The American’.

Boru

[Duty]

Always an education - so the title's even more racist and retarded than I had at first perceived - how...er...something.

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Sheerans contention was that it was his participation in WW2 that accounted for his later aptitude and involvement in organized crime.   His recollection of "the good old days" was that it was essentially a string of warcrimes.

Godwin.

[Duty]

Scorcese directed "silence" - big death horror torture flik...cheap kicks, fuck Scorceses and all his fans, pathetic ugly cunts.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Scorcese directed "silence" - big death horror torture flik...cheap kicks, fuck Scorceses and all his fans, pathetic ugly cunts.

This from the self-confessed ‘massive fan’ of the ‘Hellraiser’ series.

Credibility nil, you hypocritical twatwaffle.

Boru

[EgoDeath]

I'm really not sure what the chip on your shoulder is about with Scorsese. To each their own man.

[Fake Messiah]

Yeah, Scorsese's "Silence" is total crap of a movie. Interestingly, there was already a Japanese movie adaptation of the same novel from 1971 which is a very good movie. The difference is that Japanese movie is made from Japanese perspective and why Japanese people didn't want Christianity in their country and why it wouldn't work, while Scorsese made it from Christian perspective wanting to show Christian passion and, of course, got lost in being artsy fartsy because there's no passion behind it, only business and insanity.

[The Grand Nudger]

Always an education - so the title's even more racist and retarded than I had at first perceived - how...er...something.

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Sheerans contention was that it was his participation in WW2 that accounted for his later aptitude and involvement in organized crime.   His recollection of "the good old days" was that it was essentially a string of warcrimes.

Godwin.

No, you misunderstand, he was telling stories about americans killing german pow's for any number of reasons. It was this that he likened to organized crime. An officer told you to do it, and you did it, and no one had a problem with it or gave it much extra thought (or, if you did, this was a temporary state of affairs, you'd come around). Whether this was true, or just true enough in the way that war stories are - up for grabs. Just like his recollection of the events the movie depicts.

As far as the fbi was concerned, he was full of shit. It seems odd to lie about killing jimmy hoffa, but people have told stranger lies. It should go without saying that the military denies that his depiction of the american gi was accurate in any broad sense. The things he talked about happened, maybe not specifically with his unit, but they could have been stories he heard and attached to the myth he was constructing. He served in combat four times longer than was average. No matter how we view his version of events, we can probably take his word for it when he mentions that he was desensitized to killing in the process. I, personally, have no doubt that this portion of his narrative is true.

I suppose it would be a different movie if they leaned in on that, but it wouldn't be accurate to the character. As horrid as it sounds, it was his offhand way of dismissing people who had a kneejerk reaction to him killing people. "How could you do that!?!" OFC he killed people. Killing wasn't a huge deal to him.

To give some context - Sheeran remembered capturing a german supply unit. They ate what they wanted, pissed on the rest of it, then ordered the germans to dig their own graves. He says they did...without complaint.....and he joked about them thinking that him and his buddies were going to change their minds. They didn't. He gets out at 25 "but only according to the calendar", and goes home. He starts a family, he works a normal job. Ten years later he gets involved with organized crime through that job, at a low level - deliveries and driving...eventually working for hoffa..painting houses™.

The movie was about the one killing that he ever expressed any remorse or misgivings for, that he may not have committed, and the pain that he and his family suffered as a consequence of his life decisions. He dies alone, sick, unknown, spinning tall tales to the only people who will listen...but never giving away any details that would lead to a new conviction. If that glorifies his life in any way, consider that it might be the viewer doing the glorifying. Frank, for his part...

Mary did the raising of the girls. All my daughters never gave me a headache on their behavior. Not due to my care. Due to their mother’s attention and the way she raised them…I feel very bad about it now. I wasn’t an abusive father, but I started getting a little neglectful, and Mary was too good a woman, too easy on me. Then at some point, I just joined that other culture and I stopped coming home…I was a selfish bastard. I thought I was doing good by giving money, but I didn’t give the kids enough family time.

-and so we have to reconcile a murderous teamster with the above, the actual human being that the murderous teamster was. He's out there offing people, but the part that sticks is how it took up so much of his time.