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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 12:05 pm
Quote:If God is not competent to stop an earthquake or save its victims, he is definitely not competent to create a world. And if he is powerful enough to do both, but created a dangerous world that inflicts violent and agonizing sufferings arbitrarily on sentient creatures, then he is vile. Either way, what are people thinking who believe in such a being, and who go to church to praise and worship it?
It's all so absurd. I just can't understand people. Religious belief can be so selfish... God loves you and saves you from disaster, but if he kills thousands along the way (most of which are probably not Christian, so would likely go to hell anyway), well that's just part of his grand, noble plan. Idiotic humans... we need to stop being so goddamn naive.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 12:12 pm
(March 13, 2011 at 12:05 pm)OnlyNatural Wrote: It's all so absurd. I just can't understand people. Religious belief can be so selfish... God loves you and saves you from disaster, but if he kills thousands along the way (most of which are probably not Christian, so would likely go to hell anyway), well that's just part of his grand, noble plan. Idiotic humans... we need to stop being so goddamn naive.
Its intellectual suicide. Suicide is saying "this life isnt worth living". A leap of faith is saying the same thing as "this life isnt worth living, so therefore I will ignore reality and live in a fantasy world." It doesnt matter wether a god exists or not..having faith in a god is the exact same thing as suicide...it is intellectual suicide. These people are the walking dead...zombies...living in a world of faith and refusing cold, hard reality.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 1:58 pm
(March 13, 2011 at 10:24 am)fr0d0 Wrote: (March 13, 2011 at 10:07 am)theVOID Wrote: An omnibenevolent God necessarily would That is obviously wrong. This is a tricky one. A god may only be able to maximise, bring about the best possible set of circumstances, "save" the most people (in a heavenly sense) rather than use all of the omnipowers to prevent all suffering all the time. A theist case can be made here. I think it shot full of holes however.
Philosophically the theist would need to reconcile ominbenevolence with the existence of innocent suffering/evil. They can only do that by saying its the best that god could do and bring people freely to him. However this defence is lost if god can materialise a worlds where both free people freely come to believe in him and there is no suffering. Apparently this has been done in he case of heaven, eden and the post flood earth. From a real world perspective. Can a theist utter these words and be serious. The babies killed in the womb as the natural disaster strikes. It is an appeal to emotion, but come on what is more likely: there is a big friendly sky fairy wringing his hands while millions die saying to himself "shit I wish I could do better, but that would mean I shat all over their free will", or there isn't and shit happens.
"I still say a church steeple with a lightning rod on top shows a lack of confidence"...Doug McLeod.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 2:21 pm
Scientists concluded that natural disasters were a good thing because it's this very thing that supports life on this planet. BASTARD SCIENTISTS!!! 
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 3:05 pm
(This post was last modified: March 13, 2011 at 3:06 pm by OnlyNatural.)
(March 13, 2011 at 2:21 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Scientists concluded that natural disasters were a good thing because it's this very thing that supports life on this planet. BASTARD SCIENTISTS!!!
Ah yes, good old tectonic plates and volcanic eruptions, keeping the carbon cycle going and regulating the planet's temperature since time immemorial. These things were never a source of such massive devastation until humans colonized pretty much the entire globe. I deeply sympathize with the families who have lost loved ones, but as unpleasant as it is for us, 'natural disasters' are a part of life on Earth, always have been and always will be.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 3:44 pm
(March 13, 2011 at 9:49 am)Skipper Wrote: Any thoughts from the religious folk here? Other than the usual, God moves in mysterious ways. The devil did it. Blah blah blah. Okay..The Devil moves in mysterious ways. God did it.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 8:37 pm
(March 13, 2011 at 2:21 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Scientists concluded that natural disasters were a good thing because it's this very thing that supports life on this planet. BASTARD SCIENTISTS!!!
That means nothing in this argument. If god created what sustained life on this planet, he could have easily made it naturally possible for the planet to sustain life or create or maintain life without natural disasters such as this.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 10:21 pm
(March 13, 2011 at 10:24 am)fr0d0 Wrote: (March 13, 2011 at 10:07 am)theVOID Wrote: An omnibenevolent God necessarily would That is obviously wrong.
A being who is necessarily loving of all things necessarily cares about all things.
So you're wrong, again.
.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 10:31 pm
(March 13, 2011 at 8:37 pm)Skipper Wrote: (March 13, 2011 at 2:21 pm)fr0d0 Wrote: Scientists concluded that natural disasters were a good thing because it's this very thing that supports life on this planet. BASTARD SCIENTISTS!!!
That means nothing in this argument. If god created what sustained life on this planet, he could have easily made it naturally possible for the planet to sustain life or create or maintain life without natural disasters such as this.
God did create a perfect world, Satan and people like you and me caused the imperfections that are seen in the world.
theVOID, where do you get this word omnibenevolent from, yes God is benevolent but sometimes (especially) when there is judgement involved God may not seem to be benevolent. Now do not misunderstand, I'm not saying this awful disaster was judgement from God, I do believe this earthquake was part of what happens on this planet. Yes I do believe that God could have stopped this event, that however did not happen for what ever reason and I guess you'll have to ask God why. As for why doesn't He stop natural disasters, how do we know He hasn't, when and if He does we would never know because it never happened.
God loves those who believe and those who do not and the same goes for me, you have no choice in this matter. That puts the matter of total free will to rest.
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RE: God and Distaster
March 13, 2011 at 10:43 pm
Quote:God did create a perfect world, Satan and people like you and me
If that were true it would substantiate the fact that your god is a fucking asshole. If "perfection" chooses to create "imperfection" then it is not "perfection."
If it were true and your god just decided to fuck with us then he is just a scumbag.
In either case....not very 'godlike.'
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